The Al-X Relationship Tread

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#747

Discuss relationships, marriage, dating, friend zones and the single life here.

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  • #57731

    By the way, @Al-x, I approve of your current avatar. :rose:

  • #57733

    Thanks, @njerry

  • #57757

    Stop bringing this one up. Seriously, just fucking stop it.

    sooo… would this be a good time to blow a gasket and spam “YOU just fucking stop it, FUCK FACE!!!!1” on every comment you make everywhere on the forum? Or is that too on the nose?

    Asking for a friend… xD

  • #57759

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    I’m bisexual, can I even have friends?

    Stop bringing this one up. Seriously, just fucking stop it.

    Because I’m demisexual and bi, I primarily get attracted to people by personality rather than looks, so I’m definitely not allowed have friends.

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  • #57768

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    I’m bisexual, can I even have friends?

    Stop bringing this one up. Seriously, just fucking stop it.

    Because I’m demisexual and bi, I primarily get attracted to people by personality rather than looks, so I’m definitely not allowed have friends.

    Be honest, Lorcan. There’s also a court order in effect in your case.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #57769

    Stop bringing this one up. Seriously, just fucking stop it.

    sooo… would this be a good time to blow a gasket and spam “YOU just fucking stop it, FUCK FACE!!!!1” on every comment you make everywhere on the forum? Or is that too on the nose?

    Asking for a friend… xD

    Sure, go ahead.

    edit: Fuckface.

  • #57773

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    I’m bisexual, can I even have friends?

    Stop bringing this one up. Seriously, just fucking stop it.

    Because I’m demisexual and bi, I primarily get attracted to people by personality rather than looks, so I’m definitely not allowed have friends.

    Be honest, Lorcan. There’s also a court order in effect in your case.

    I’m fighting to get that overturned!

    3 users thanked author for this post.
  • #57828

    And in celebrity breakup news, Jennifer Lopez and Alex Rodriguez have broken up and ended their engagement.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #57841

    No more LopRod?! Tragic!!

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #57902

    Back on the topic of three-way relationships:

    The rise of polyamorous parenting: Why ‘throuple’ families are coming out

  • #57906

    Interestingly, fwiw, some guys think that if they become friends with a bisexual woman, they might get “lucky” someday and get a 3some out of it. Apparently, they watched to much Cinemax back in the day…

    Also, here is a pic of Rudy and his daughter:

    7da63ea9944d4659900a4db60d1ff0b0_md

  • #57939

    And it seems the reports of the J-Lo/A-Rod breakup are inaccurate.

  • #57951

    And it seems the reports of the J-Lo/A-Rod breakup are inaccurate.

  • #57952

    Interestingly, fwiw, some guys think that if they become friends with a bisexual woman, they might get “lucky” someday and get a 3some out of it. Apparently, they watched to much Cinemax back in the day…

    And where do you get that information from, Al?

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #57961

    Al-x wrote:
    Interestingly, fwiw, some guys think that if they become friends with a bisexual woman, they might get “lucky” someday and get a 3some out of it. Apparently, they watched to much Cinemax back in the day…

    And where do you get that information from, Al?

    Every time Al posts “some guys think” replace it with “I think.”

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  • #57967

    Interestingly, fwiw, some guys think that if they become friends with a bisexual woman, they might get “lucky” someday and get a 3some out of it. Apparently, they watched to much Cinemax back in the day…

    Well there’s always a chance.

     

  • #57990

    Actually, I was watching some show years ago where a few women of different orientations were interviewed about their experiences. The bisexual woman said that guys think of her as a “treat” and try to befriend her for the reason I said above.

    Interestingly, the lesbian in the panel commented on guys who wanted to “convert” her… but I digress.

  • #58139

    Interestingly, fwiw, some guys think that if they become friends with a bisexual woman, they might get “lucky” someday and get a 3some out of it. Apparently, they watched to much Cinemax back in the day…

    And where do you get that information from, Al?

    Every time Al posts “some guys think” replace it with “I think.”

    Wait… not that I am that clever, but are you guys upset that you didn’t think about that strategy first? :-)

  • #58213

    Actually, I was watching some show years ago where a few women of different orientations were interviewed about their experiences. The bisexual woman said that guys think of her as a “treat” and try to befriend her for the reason I said above.

    So the answer to where you get your information from is, one woman said this some years ago on some TV show.

    You know, I think this might not be the most reliable of sources.

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  • #58288

    So the answer to where you get your information from is, one woman said this some years ago on some TV show.

    You know, I think this might not be the most reliable of sources.

    It was an interesting late night show on cable TV from the woman’s perspective of how “slick” some guys think they are, befriending a bisexual, befriending a lesbian to possibly “convert” her someday as well as to pick up “tips” or advice on oral matters for their girlfriend… or trying to “trick”/seduce a virgin who wants to “save” herself for a “special” someone.

    You want to question it all, be my guest but it now falls on you to present articles and other info to contribute to this thread.

    Anyone can refute another poster, but it takes someone real to back up what they post.

    • This reply was modified 3 years, 9 months ago by Al-x.
  • #58304

    So the answer to where you get your information from is, one woman said this some years ago on some TV show. You know, I think this might not be the most reliable of sources.

    Christian, you’re a man, you’re not claiming you know more about a woman’s experience than a… woman?

    I’m so proud of you. Welcome to the 1970s, brother :heart:

     

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  • #58306

    The reality is, Al, that I have been and am friends with quite a lot of bisexual people (including Anders) and have never speculated on having a threesome with them. And that goes for the vast majority of people, I am sure. I also have queer and transsexual friends, and in spite of being a heterosexual male I am friends with a lot of women of different sexual orientations. That is the banal reality for most of us in the 21st century, but it’s not what drives late night talkshows.

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  • #58311

    am friends with quite a lot of bisexual people (including Anders)

    Awww…

    and have never speculated on having a threesome with them.

    LIIIIIEEES!!!

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  • #58313

    You should have said that from the start @christian

    What you said about late night TV shows is true and maybe it also an American thing.

    Anyway, about this thread… What is its scope? We make some funny comments and observations on dating, but I feel we can be a little more serious in talking about relationships. For example, relationships are partly about negotiating with the other person, a give and take. Have you been in a relationship with someone who was more of a “taker” and doesn’t give back? Also, sadly, some break up but eventually go back to a previous unfruitful relationship because “the devil that you know is better than the devil that you don’t know”. Then there are relationships where the two grow apart over some time, other relationships where the two decide to stay together because of the kids… So many different things we can get into. Just saying…

  • #58314

    Relationships are complex animals and dissecting where one went wrong is both complex and difficult and when it comes to the specifics also rather private. I will say this: I think one of the things that isn’t so broadly discussed is that none of us go into this knowing how to deal with relationships, and that figuring it out can be bloody difficult. I think with many, many, many couples the true problem isn’t the kind of imbalance you mention – I mean, that is a problem, and there are other typical problems of course, but the deeper problem behind that is that we are not very well equipped to deal with these surface problems when they arise. A lot of the time people just try to ignore the troubles and carry on and hope the problems will go away. Actually actually talking to your partner about the things that are maybe going wrong in a relationship and coming to terms with them is really rather difficult.

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  • #58320

    Christian wrote: and have never speculated on having a threesome with them. LIIIIIEEES!!!

    Aww Christian, you’ve done gone and broken poor Anders’ heart :wacko:

    It’s okay Anders I am sure there is overly tall, hair length fluctuating hidden Skrull out there for you. Just keeping dreaming.

    2 users thanked author for this post.
  • #58333

    I am not sure the heart is the organ we’re addressing here.

    5 users thanked author for this post.
  • #58338

    It can be two things!!

    3 users thanked author for this post.
  • #58345

    4573018E-6811-47C0-B21E-AD9ACD794C0D

    2 users thanked author for this post.
  • #58413

    Relationships are complex animals and dissecting where one went wrong is both complex and difficult and when it comes to the specifics also rather private. I will say this: I think one of the things that isn’t so broadly discussed is that none of us go into this knowing how to deal with relationships, and that figuring it out can be bloody difficult. I think with many, many, many couples the true problem isn’t the kind of imbalance you mention – I mean, that is a problem, and there are other typical problems of course, but the deeper problem behind that is that we are not very well equipped to deal with these surface problems when they arise. A lot of the time people just try to ignore the troubles and carry on and hope the problems will go away. Actually actually talking to your partner about the things that are maybe going wrong in a relationship and coming to terms with them is really rather difficult.

    We don’t want to hurt the one we love but acts of omission do damage. It’s not always easy to have certain talks but they are absolutely worth it.

    Trust is key. You have to trust each other. That takes time and energy to build, strengthen, and maintain. All that work is worth it, though. To know someone completely has your back and you can be vulnerable with brings not only immeasurable strength to each individual but to the relationship itself.

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  • #58460

    In light of recent posts about “throuples”:

    https://people.com/tv/seeking-sister-wife-couple-to-divorce-in-order-to-have-brazilian-woman-join-plural-marriage-trailer/?utm_campaign=peoplemagazine&utm_content=link&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=605354d083d5780001595ce4&fbclid=IwAR2woxSMeYPi54kbApvNB4BwOJqLNqjh8cq3xngHcxslI4jiv5_8M8PxymA

  • #58466

    Ok…

    In this thread, we mostly keep things light. Even when I say some of my “al-xisms” like “dating shape”, “happening kind of guy”, etc… it is just small talk on meeting someone, socializing, and going out. But there is so much more to a relationship than just scoring on a hot date or a one night stand. We can all keep the thread light or get into deeper subject matter of a relationship. It is totally up to you.

    On a side note, I sort of miss the old days, when posters like Stephanie and Sabrina would challenge me all the time. They had great input, I will admit.

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  • #58471

    In this thread, we mostly keep things light. Even when I say some of my “al-xisms” like “dating shape”, “happening kind of guy”, etc… it is just small talk on meeting someone, socializing, and going out. But there is so much more to a relationship than just scoring on a hot date or a one night stand. We can all keep the thread light or get into deeper subject matter of a relationship. It is totally up to you.

    As we often say here at The Carrier and in previous incarnations of Millarworld: “It can be two things!”

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  • #58938

    In the spirit of keeping things light for now…

    This is something that @jrcarter would post but I will beat him to it:

    https://popculture.com/celebrity-couples/news/orlando-bloom-admits-he-katy-perry-arent-having-enough-sex/?fbclid=IwAR14ix-goV0pM3qzaJdfOlcr5YmJJ_KS0c6JawbWjfgxudvM_VPQbygnNpg

    Is this a common complaint for you all? :-)

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  • #58939

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

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  • #58941

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

  • #58944

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

    Everyone knows it’s one of the things that keeps you awake at night.

    2 users thanked author for this post.
  • #58952

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

    Everyone knows it’s one of the things that keeps you awake at night.

    He could just thump on the wall and tell them to keep it down.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #58958

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

    Everyone knows it’s one of the things that keeps you awake at night.

    Actually ladies do that about Al, but I digress.

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  • #59071

    Actually ladies do that about Al, but I digress.

    LOL…That was funny.

    Now…

    I asked this before but :Would you sacrifice your pursuits and “take a back seat” to let your partner succeed in their career?

    —————————-

    If you were in a “white collar” profession (corporate office, doctor, lawyer), would you mind being in a relationship with someone who is, say, a “blue collar” worker?

    —————————–

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    Interestingly, fwiw, there are some women who have gay male friends and feel “safe” and comfortable around them because there is no “sexual tension” there and they also know that it all won’t end up with them in bed together.

    However, there are gay (not bisexual) men who are married and have children.

    ——————————

    Personally, I am mostly a “live and let live” person, yet there are some things I am somewhat conservative on. Spring started already and the weather is getting warmer. I have to say that a woman can wear whatever she wants in public within reason. I feel however, that some (not all) need to rethink things over and possibly put on some more clothes before going outside. Maybe I am getting old, but I have seen some things that make me shake my head and do a face palm. There was a fashion style in the past that apparently is coming back where a young woman wears a large handkerchief tied around her to her back for a top.

    Hey… to each their own.

  • #59079

    I asked this before but :Would you sacrifice your pursuits and “take a back seat” to let your partner succeed in their career?

    If it made sense financially and in terms of the relationship, yes.

    If you were in a “white collar” profession (corporate office, doctor, lawyer), would you mind being in a relationship with someone who is, say, a “blue collar” worker?

    If it made sense financially and in terms of the relationship, yes.

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    For most men and most women, absolutely.

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  • #59090

    Personally, I am mostly a “live and let live” person, yet there are some things I am somewhat conservative on. Spring started already and the weather is getting warmer. I have to say that a woman can wear whatever she wants in public within reason. I feel however, that some (not all) need to rethink things over and possibly put on some more clothes before going outside.

    How do other peoples’ choices of clothing affect you in any way whatsoever?

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  • #59100

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    Why would I complain about how much sex Orlando Bloom is having?

    If he’s keeping Katy Perry happy that way, I’d thank him for taking one for the team.

  • #59151

    How do other peoples’ choices of clothing affect you in any way whatsoever?

    I can’t say it does, but some choices make me wonder what they are thinking.

    We spoke about this before. (I remember T Masters replying to me about it.)
    I have to say a woman can wear what she wants within reason. She wants to make a statement with her clothing style (This is how sexy I am etc.) that is her business. I have no input, just my own personal opinion which I keep to myself.

  • #59154

    Is this a common complaint for you all?

    I don’t know what he’s complaining about. I’m have zero sex with Katy Perry. I should be complaining! :-)

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  • #59160

    How do other peoples’ choices of clothing affect you in any way whatsoever?

    He’s talking about women, not people. Dogs need to be leashed.

  • #59173

    How dare women wear what they want! They should just remain as pretty adornments to Al’s profile – keep them in a one-inch square where they belong, not as actual human beings!

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  • #59177

    There are some interesting elements to fitness and appearance from a sociological or anthropological perspective. Fitness, as practiced, isn’t always healthy, obviously, as many of the super-ripped or “shredded” and massively muscled body types with under 10% body fat are only achievable through drug abuse and damaging dietary practices for 90% of the people. On top of that, often the people that obsessed over their appearance do not have healthy sex lives, and we are seeing an increase in a fixation on maintaining a “sexy” appearance – and showing it off whether in public or in the new social media avenues – but without much increased interest in actually finding a mate or having sex (or especially in having any children).

    Looking sexy and not having sex may not be directly related though as other social factors are related: Why Young Adults, Especially Men, Are Having Sex Less Frequently (healthline.com) 

    However, it is interesting. Reminds me a bit of the “beautiful ones” phase of the NIMH population sink experiments: How 1960s Mouse Utopias Led to Grim Predictions for Future of Humanity | Smart News | Smithsonian Magazine

    The few secluded spaces housed a population Calhoun called, “the beautiful ones.” Generally guarded by one male, the females—and few males—inside the space didn’t breed or fight or do anything but eat and groom and sleep. When the population started declining the beautiful ones were spared from violence and death, but had completely lost touch with social behaviors, including having sex or caring for their young.

    I mentioned in the science thread that scientists are now concerned at the decline in the fertility rate as well: Reproductive Problems in Both Men and Women Are Rising at an Alarming Rate – Scientific American

    In the 70’s, there was a concern over global overpopulation, and that’s starting to reverse a little. I do suspect that some policies related to over-population response might have contributed to the decline, but I’m not really convince of a direct connection.

    Experts sound the alarm on declining birth rates among younger generations: “It’s a crisis” – CBS News

    The drop could present an entirely different risk to society than one that was first warned about decades ago — when an apocalyptic fear gripped America in the 1960s and 1970s.

    “The stakes in this battle are far greater than any other we have ever fought,” Walter Cronkite said in a 1970 CBS News broadcast. “The experts we interviewed told us population was the fundamental crisis.”

    As the world stampeded toward 10 billion people, many researchers back then predicted that overpopulation would ruin humanity.

    Biologist Paul Ehrlich once explained the threat as “The Population Bomb,” the title of a book he authored in 1968.

    “Sometime in the next 15 years [that’s by 1984 from when the book was published, of course], the end will come — and by the end, I mean an utter breakdown of the capacity of the planet to support humanity,”  he said in a 1970 broadcast.

    Today, however, a very different note is struck by researchers like University of Southern California Professor Dowell Myers, who studies demographic trends.

    “The trouble is we overshot and we dropped it down too much now,” Myers told “CBS This Morning” co-host Tony Dokoupil. 

    While the global population is still growing, a major study published in The Lancet in 2020 predicted it would peak in 2064, and then fall by nearly a billion people by the end of the century — the reason being, fewer babies.

  • #59193

    How dare women wear what they want! They should just remain as pretty adornments to Al’s profile – keep them in a one-inch square where they belong, not as actual human beings!

    Why say that? Why be so combative?

    I did say live and let live, but a few experiences I know of make me say “within reason”:

    I worked with a woman who said that she was once followed by a man when she got off the subway. I know of another woman who almost got ambushed into a van. I was working out in the gym and there was a woman working out in a barely there top. When she noticed that more than a few guys were looking/staring at her, she went back to the locker room and came back out in a sweat shirt.

    What I am saying is that it is not a perfect world. There is a reason why some women will cross the street to avoid construction workers or a bunch of rowdy guys loitering up the block. (That is not a knock on all construction workers but… you know what I mean).

    Women have to be cautious these days and I understand that. It is just that sometimes when I see someone rather carefree about things, I just say to myself that they should be more careful.

    I went on dates in nice restaurants and all the women there in the other tables dressed sexy for their dates. Same thing in the singles bars and dance clubs. Again, depends on the occasion.

    I guess the difference here in these recent postings is that some here are arguing for the right for women to do what ever they want and I feel that I am going a little further in saying to also be cautious.

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  • #59195

    I guess the difference here in these recent postings is that some here are arguing for the right for women to do what ever they want and I feel that I am going a little further in saying to also be cautious.

    You’re right, it’s the responsibility of women to stop men abusing them. If they just dressed more modestly that would never happen again.

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  • #59198

    Can a man and a woman just be friends?

    Yes, absolutely. I don’t know why you keep asking this.

    Look “When Harry Met Sally’ was a great movie and all that but this literally happens all the time, in relationships that last for decades.

    I have a good friend, a Swedish guy called Stefan, and his wife is really into sci-fi books and movies. He worked in the oil business so was often away, so me and his wife Sandra went to the movies together all the time, both partners fully aware.  I don’t fancy her and as far as I know she’s never fancied me, zero flirting or anything else happened, we just shared a common interest and liked watching and talking about the movies.

    That is a man and a woman just being friends and it’s one example of dozens in my life and millions in the world.

    So your question is answered Al.

     

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  • #59203

    Yeah, I don’t know why anyone would ever seriously consider the question unless they thought all men saw all women purely through the lens of being sex objects.

    I’ve had loads of female friends over the years where there’s been nothing beyond simple friendship. Women I’ve socialised with, women I’ve gone out to the cinema or for meals with, even women I’ve lived with (for years in some cases). Many of my closest friends are female. Turns out women are just people!

  • #59204

    You’re right, it’s the responsibility of women to stop men abusing them. If they just dressed more modestly that would never happen again.

    Steve… fellow… why so sarcastic and combative? That is not what I am saying at all.

    I don’t blame the victim and there are no “rape me” clothes.

    Let me turn the tables on you: Are you saying that a woman shouldn’t be careful in certain situations?

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  • #59232

    Are you saying that a woman shouldn’t be careful in certain situations?

    The point is they shouldn’t have to be. I don’t know if this made the news Stateside, but recently a young woman went missing in London (it was later discovered she’d been murdered… by a police officer) and the advice before an arrest was made was that women shouldn’t go out alone. As one female politician said at the time, why should the women stay home? Why not the men?

    So instead of worrying about what women should or shouldn’t do, how about you just do your bit so they don’t have to be careful.

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  • #59260

    I heard about what happened to the woman and the big demonstration over there.
    It is tragic what happened and it shouldn’t be that way. But it is.

    Originally, in my post, it was just a side note saying that, while I don’t consider myself a prude, I still have some conservative ways. I still have my limits.

    For the record, the handkerchief top is like this:

    04EB8B51-0C56-4334-9962-2D7F3D103425

    Now, would I impose and forbid some young woman to walk in NYC like this? No. It is her right.

    Do I worry about what they should or shouldn’t do? No

    Do I do my part so they don’t have to be careful? Yes.

    I know women who have been raped and heard what they went through. Different experiences, different perspectives, and so on lead to difference of outlook and opinions.

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  • #59265

    I have a good friend, a Swedish guy called Stefan, and his wife is really into sci-fi books and movies. He worked in the oil business so was often away, so me and his wife Sandra went to the movies together all the time, both partners fully aware.  I don’t fancy her and as far as I know she’s never fancied me, zero flirting or anything else happened, we just shared a common interest and liked watching and talking about the movies. That is a man and a woman just being friends and it’s one example of dozens in my life and millions in the world.

    It’s still an interesting question more from the friendship side. I think you have question from the other side just in case initial opinions are not as sound. For example, in this culture – or your culture – is it difficult for a man and woman to be best friends? Or even really close friends?

    I do see problems there, of course, primarily among young, very sexually motivated people, but culturally, in general it seems rare for extremely close friendships to form between men and women. Culture plays a big part, probably far more than biology, in that some cultures just don’t allow it. I cannot be alone in a house with any of my wife’s Thai friends, for example, as that is considered entirely improper no matter how friendly we are. I’m sure in traditional Jewish or Arab cultures, you’d find similar restrictions between men and women who are not married to each other.

    However, primarily, I think it is not easy or even desirable in our culture to form really close friendships with anyone. Like in your situation above, that sounds like you are friendly with your friend’s wife and not necessarily a close friend of hers. It would interesting to hear how she would characterize your relationship. Possibly she see you a “her” friend or would she tell her other friends that you are her husband’s friend. Or maybe even “their” friend which I’ve found common in couples. She has her friends, he has his friends and they have shared friends all delineated in case of separation.

    I don’t think I’ve ever known a man and woman who were best friends entirely devoid of any potential or former romantic relationship. Again, though, most of these friendships are really “friendly” relationships, not deep friendships, but, again, I’ve also found deep friendships between anybody to be extremely rare irrespective of gender differences. We have friendly relationships for the most part that rely on being enjoyable as opposed to the deep friendships where you might have to put in some effort or contribute in dire times.

    I’ve had some deep relationships with women who I did not have a romantic relationship with, but it was in the context of one of us pursuing a romance and the other not interested in romance. The friendships did not last.

    However, I do think any difficulty forming a friendship is primarily cultural and that could be changing.

    A tougher question is can a two people of different genders form a truly deep friendship without it becoming a romantic relationship even though they find each other attractive? Like two people married to other partners who have the opportunity and desire to have an affair, but prefer their friendship. It’s possible, but I can accept there might be difficulties.

  • #59280

    Those are interesting questions, if I spent every day with Sandra as my best friend, totally platonically, would it be accepted by our spouses? Probably not, it’d be a little strange. (As to your question I met them both at the same time so it would probably be ‘their’ or ‘her’ friend rather than ‘his’).

    However at this stage of life, as you hinted at, I don’t know many people who do have that kind of relationship, regardless of gender.  It changes really as you or they get partners, I haven’t had a ‘best friend’ in that way for maybe 23 years.

    They are essentially interesting extensions though from Al’s main question which I think is obviously wrong.

     

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  • #59296

    Yes, I’m fairly doubtful that biology actually plays as strong a role in relationships as is popularly spouted in many pop science articles or videos. I’m not a big proponent of using biology as an explanation since, obviously, we are all basically doing things we were not biologically designed to do every day. Culture seems a far better explanation. Someone could argue that culture emerged from biology, but I’d say it’s just as likely – or even more likely – culture emerged in contrast to biology or to directly counter biological urges.

    As mentioned, many cultures overtly prevent friendships between men and women who are not married and only encourage marital relationships, but even in the most traditional cultures, adultery is still common. I think there might be less adultery if there was greater cultural support for platonic friendships. In a culture that keeps the genders separate, when a man and woman are attracted to each other, they won’t have much to talk about so sex is about the only thing they can do together.

    So, I do feel that close friendships between individual men and women are possible, but they are discouraged and more difficult than close friendships between the same gender which are already quite difficult to form in any case.

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  • #59441

    Al’s main question which I think is obviously wrong.

    I think I am basically asexual. Most interaction I have with women is conversational. I have rarely pursued women for sex. I have a female friend who I have known for over 20 years. She has a husband and 3 kids. Early on, there was some people who thought there was something between us but I have developed a resistance to peer pressure so I ignored them. My main attraction is wit and personality.  I don’t hesitate in talking to good looking women because there are no stakes on the line and my opening line is not a pickup line. If I get rejected its no big deal and if they have trouble grasping the concept that I am not after them sexually then they failed the wit checkbox and I am better off not knowing them.

    My main philosophy is treat people like human beings. We are all human beings despite our differences in plumbing so treat everyone the same. You’d be surprised how successful you can be if you do.

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  • #59449

    I wonder if that is good advice generally though, Certainly, I don’t think it would help anyone who is sexually active or pursuing a romantic/marital relationship. It seems like we are somewhat taught by the culture that people should just let things happen, but that is really terrible advice. Maybe the result of the fact most people are not going to find sex or love with the right person. So really it’s saying, “don’t bother.”

    It doesn’t matter what it is, if you want something, then there is a big difference between being relaxed and confident versus being passive.

    Usually, nothing anyone really wants is just going to come to them of its own accord, and often what does come to you is often stuff that you really don’t want.

    So, if a people are looking for mates, either short or long term, they can’t treat everyone the same. In those situations, there are stakes involved.

  • #59453

    I did start that post by saying I am probably asexual. I am not looking for a mate or sex. I agree it does NOT work for everyone. I have not gone on dates with any of the women I have met. But I have gone to bars, concerts, sporting events, and movies with them. I am or have been friends with them and some times they have said it was fun not worrying what will happen at the end of the night. Most likely my no.1 sin according to Christianity is I am not looking to multiply.

    there is a big difference between being relaxed and confident and being passive.

    I agree completely. I am not passive at all. If I enjoy their company I say so. That is how I have gone out with them to concerts, movies, and sporting events. if you want to know about the financial aspects, it is mixed: I’ve paid, they have paid, and we have split the cost. Maybe I am a vary rare individual but I really do prefer conversation over sexual tension.

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  • #59463

    I get that. I don’t criticize the position, but I do wonder if it is considerate in some situations.

    For example you mention the part about checking girls off the list if they don’t grasp that you’re not into them sexually. I think that probably implies that they are there with the intent of finding a partner and not just good conversation. If you weren’t being clear from the outset that you’re not interested in that, then it’s not fair to them especially in a setting where that expectation is implied. If you are being clear at the outset, then there is nothing wrong with them breaking off and moving on to someone else. It’s essentially a waste of their time if they are looking for some sexual or emotional relationship.

    That’s more in the obvious settings though like clubs or bars where people go to hook up – or, of course, an actual date where the intent is right out in the open.

    That’s what I mean by the failure of culture to really prepare people today anyway for starting relationships. To have one person thinking that this is just a pleasant social interaction and the other intending this to be a prelude to sex or emotional commitment should not be happening.

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  • #59485

    https://www.buzzfeed.com/victoriavouloumanos/hard-to-swallow-pills-about-relationships

  • #59521

    Maybe I am a vary rare individual but I really do prefer conversation over sexual tension.

    I wouldn’t call myself asexual but I agree being natural and feeling comfortable is more valuable to me than the intricacies and rules of courtship and sexual tension. I am not actively looking for relationships or sex and it make me much more relaxed than when I was.

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  • #59640

    They are essentially interesting extensions though from Al’s main question which I think is obviously wrong.

    You know… normally I would object to this but then something occurred to me…

    Over the years, I would post in the thread and so many would disagree with me on points I make. Not just the posters now but here are a few names from the past: RussellH, Parker McCombe, Henry Blanco, Will, T Masters, Johnny California, Craggy, and so many more. Even women like Stephanie (who called me a douche once and gave me the finger) and Sabrina. I figure that they can’t all be wrong. They all apparently see something in my comments I don’t. It is a blind spot for me.

    What can I say now? I guess you can say I am being introspective, realizing things now with all this quarantine time. So, I will do better to see other views and perspectives. It is an open forum after all.

    2 users thanked author for this post.
  • #59645

    here are a few names from the past: RussellH, Parker McCombe, Henry Blanco, Will, T Masters, Johnny California, Craggy, and so many more

    5 users thanked author for this post.
  • #59653

    Even women like Stephanie (who called me a douche once and gave me the finger) and Sabrina. I figure that they can’t all be wrong.

    “Even women…”

  • #59656

    https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7bufgPP70ra2ZVi8/giphy.gif

  • #59657

    Well, its not as though we can refer to them as people, can we.

  • #59658

    Well, its not as though we can refer to them as people, can we.

    Is that what you and especially Steve want to harp on?!? Seriously?

    I can very easily turn the tables on both of you, but I just choose not to, for now.

  • #59659

    Well, it’s come to something when I’m wishing the Relationship Thread would go back to how it usually is.

    2 users thanked author for this post.
  • #59672

    What can I say now? I guess you can say I am being introspective, realizing things now with all this quarantine time. So, I will do better to see other views and perspectives. It is an open forum after all.

    You’re free to express your opinions, and others are free to agree or disagree. I think people like and respect you, but sometimes your opinions in this thread, are a bit old fashioned, in the sense that you think people need to behave in certain ways, “be ladylike” etc, and people point that out to you. You don’t have to take their criticism to heart, if you don’t agree.

     

    Many people these days think that they are OK with everybody dressing how they like, however that isn’t absolute. Public nudity for instance is still condemned in most places. And there are lots of little rules and taboos on what to wear in certain cricumstances, for instance men often have to dress in certain formal ways in an office environment etc.

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  • #59682

    That was well said Arjan. It is something I am realizing more and more these days.

  • #59685

    It’s generally not seen as acceptable anymore these days to tell women how to behave in ways that are “ladylike” and might avoid unwanted attention from horny guys, because women have the right to be as promiscuous as they want, and they should be able to trust men not to behave in sexually abusive ways just because they dress a certain way.

     

    It’s a problem. In the UK after that recent murder police told women in London not to go out alone at night which caused an uproar I think. Imagine being told to stay home because there might be perverts out there trying to rape you. It’s infuriating.

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  • #59687

    To Arjan and everyone else reading this:

    I remember it all very well…

    There was a book that came out titled Undateable that listed all the turnoffs to women that men do. I posted a small listing in the MW Pub and the thread was popular and got a lot of traffic.

    Later on, in the Thought Provoking Thread days, the Relationship Thread was started in the Pub.
    In the MW Pub, the thread was getting a little graphic and I said something that women who suck c*ck are undignified and unladylike.
    Everyone railed against me: Russell H was livid, Stephanie then called me a douche and gave me the finger, and even the quiet Henry Blanco said I was dead wrong to say it. Will was a mod at the time reprimanded me and I had to back off. Jim O’Hara, who ran MW, then warned me not to get graphic again.
    Needless to say, I put my foot in my mouth.

    So, I kept it all light from then on and used more al-xisms like dating shape, happening guy etc. Of course I would still have my run ins. I said something about women being moody, and Sabrina seemed to come out of nowhere and said: “Who are you calling moody?”
    Then there were guys like Parker McCombe, T Masters, Craggy, even Lorcan, and so on. I had no idea what I started and got myself into.

    So now, this forum is Gareth’s now, and what he says goes. I feel that the Relationship thread is not a one man show. I have no hard feelings about changing the title to The Carrier Relationship Thread, The Happening Relationship Thread, or whatever.

    At the end of the day, I have no animosity towards anyone here. I wish everyone well. I realize what I have to work on and recognize my blind spots.

    Go in peace.

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  • #59694

    It is a conundrum for many people. Obviously there are men and women who still believe in a traditional style of romantic relationships. Men take the lead, women are modest, etc. And there are – actually increasingly it seems  – still a large percentage of young people that follow what we used to call the “macho” tradition – and today seems to be called the “alpha male” (not an improvement) -where masculine, very aggressive sexual approaches are the norm and there are just as many women still attracted to that. There’s nothing directly wrong with it as long as everyone involved is on board. Interfering or criticizing those sorts of relationships is no more justified than criticizing same-sex or interracial relationships.

    In this also comes the fact that a lot of what is sexually arousing is also considered taboo. Sorta like the way churches inadvertently teach people what is fun and enjoyable. The good Christians will rail against liquor, drugs, sex and rock and roll on Sunday while mentally planning to enjoy some or all of that the next Friday and Saturday night.

    If everything is permitted, then everything is boring.

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  • #59700

    So now, this forum is Gareth’s now, and what he says goes.

    Not entirely, Jim paid for MW and therefore had the final say. This board is run by me but paid for by a group of some of the members (thank for your recent donation by the way Al) so I’ve no real interest in dictating to people what should and shouldn’t be discussed. He was also concerned about Millar’s brand which is nothing we have to care about here.

    We just have a certain level of light moderation to maintain some standards and stick to the old rule of not getting into personal attacks and that’s about it.

    In fact now we have the infrastructure I’m open for members to use it how they want, if they have a group of friends into photography or stamp collecting and whatever I may not be interested in and want a sub forum for that I’ll set one up.

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  • #59710

    In this also comes the fact that a lot of what is sexually arousing is also considered taboo. Sorta like the way churches inadvertently teach people what is fun and enjoyable.

    This is true, it’s really weird. I sometimes wonder about that. What if all sexual taboos were removed, would sex still be fun? A lot of the fun is in the naughtiness. Remove that and it’s just another bodily function.

  • #59712

    In this also comes the fact that a lot of what is sexually arousing is also considered taboo. Sorta like the way churches inadvertently teach people what is fun and enjoyable.

    This is true, it’s really weird. I sometimes wonder about that. What if all sexual taboos were removed, would sex still be fun? A lot of the fun is in the naughtiness. Remove that and it’s just another bodily function.

    I mean, it is physically enjoyable as well if you do it right.

    1 user thanked author for this post.
  • #59714

    That’s true but I think the whole kink community exists in a kind of synergistic relationship with the taboos we have in society. And I think a lot of people have some kind of kinky element in their sexual psychology.

  • #59715

    That’s true but I think the whole kink community exists in a kind of synergistic relationship with the taboos we have in society. And I think a lot of people have some kind of kinky element in their sexual psychology.

    See, I don’t know if kink is intrinsically linked to taboo. There’s definitely an element of exploring desires that society deems “bad”, but I don’t think that would necessarily go away if the taboo did. Is there any correlation between a decline in people enjoying sex and the general liberalisation of sexual mores over the last 70-odd years, for instance?

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  • #59731

    That’s a good question. I have seen studies that sexual activity among young people has been in decline for the past 20 years, but for a variety of factors. However, at the same time, there hasn’t been a real liberalization of sexual mores for the past 70 years. The majority of people even in nations that are more liberal like the US and many across Europe are no more sexually liberal than they were in the 50’s. Even during the 60’s and 70’s Free Love or Summer of Love periods only reflected the participation of a few young people, and in the 80’s most of those same people were back to Ozzie and Harriet (or “Al and Peggy”) in traditional (a.k.a. unhappy) marriages having no more or more free sex than their parents had in the 40’s (or less even considering how many kids my grandparents had compared to my parents, aunts and uncles  :-) ).

    We talk about sex more openly and tolerate non-traditional arrangements a little better in mostly cosmopolitan areas, but we don’t have sex or pursue it much differently than the past few generations have. I live in the City of Sin (Los Angeles as opposed to Sin City Law Vegas) and in my circle of friends and colleagues and up and down the neighborhoods here, it’s almost entirely traditional relationship. Even same sex couples are fairly traditional in their relationships. As a result, I don’t think the taboos and kinks have really changed especially considering that many cultures in our multicultural society are actually still very conservative when it comes to sex.

  • #59732

    There’s something magical about sex, like in a sacred ritual. It is a break from everyday reality. The bedroom is like a holy temple where you share what is intimate and hidden and mysterious. I think if sex becomes too “normal” that does take something vital away from it.

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  • #59736

    Well, even without getting too spiritual about it, it’s about the most intimate thing two people can do together. Weirdly enough, it is also something you sometimes particularly want to do with a stranger, or even with someone you don’t particularly like. While it is also something very important to people who love each other.

    Sex can be many things is what I’m saying, I suppose.

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  • #59775

    there hasn’t been a real liberalization of sexual mores for the past 70 years.

    I think the internet must have changed things considerably. With the easy access to any kind of pornography nowadays and the ability to easily connect with like-minded people, I think  there’s probably been a considerable change in what is and isn’t considered acceptable.

    I’m not saying those things didn’t exist before the internet, but it’s become so much easier to indulge your kinks nowadays that there has to have been a pretty big societal shift. Some of the most popular porn terms searched for on places like Pornhub for instance are related to taboo subjects like incest, and hentai (which regularly features underage or at least young-looking characters.)

    If there really has been a reduction in sexual activity in recent years, I’d be willing to bet that doesn’t include masturbation.

     

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  • #59776

    For young teens, to lose your virginity is like a rite of passage.

  • #59785

    If there really has been a reduction in sexual activity in recent years, I’d be willing to bet that doesn’t include masturbation.

    That’s probably on the rise. :rose:

    Yeah, like in the study earlier about declining fertility, there is general scientific consensus that sexual activity between young adults has been on a decline for a while.

    Explaining the Decline in Young Adult Sexual Activity in the United States – Lei – 2021 – Journal of Marriage and Family – Wiley Online Library

    The frequency with which young adults have sexual intercourse has declined over recent decades, but the sources of this trend are not well understood. Trends in economic insecurity, relationship formation, parental coresidence, use of electronic media, psychological distress, and alcohol consumption have all been suggested as possible causes.

    Of the possible explanations considered, the decline in the formation of romantic relationships and decreasing alcohol consumption are the most important, but declining earnings and increasing use of computer games also play important roles. Overall, the measured explanations explain three‐quarters of the decline in young adult sexual activity. Within individuals, forming a romantic relationship, going to college, and alcohol consumption likely have causal effects on the probability of engaging in sexual intercourse.

    Why Young Adults, Especially Men, Are Having Sex Less Frequently (healthline.com)

    About 1 in 3 men ages 18 to 24 years reported no sexual activity in the past year, according to a new study published in JAMA Network Open.

    Between 2000-2002 and 2016-2018, past-year sexual inactivity rose from almost 19 percent to almost 31 percent among men ages 18 to 24, according to researchers led by Dr. Peter Ueda, a postdoctoral researcher at the Karolinska Institutet in Stockholm, Sweden.

    Sexual inactivity among women of the same age remained relatively constant, rising from 15 percent to 19 percent over the same time period.

    The study also found that sexual activity declined significantly among men and women ages 25 to 34 years old (7 percent versus 14 percent among men, 7 percent versus 12 percent among women).

    Sexual activity did not decline among adults ages 35 to 44 years old. [hard to go below zero :-) ]

    I’m not saying those things didn’t exist before the internet, but it’s become so much easier to indulge your kinks nowadays that there has to have been a pretty big societal shift. Some of the most popular porn terms searched for on places like Pornhub for instance are related to taboo subjects like incest, and hentai (which regularly features underage or at least young-looking characters.)

    However, I think the effect has not changed the nature of the content as much. If you go back and look at the pornography available from the 20’s to the 80’s before the Internet, it has the same (or often better) material. The same kinks were being indulged back then in print and on VHS that people consume today. The context for the material hasn’t changed much from what publishers were selling under the table well before any of us were born. The access is significantly different and absolutely more legal, but what turns people on is not much different for the majority of the population from what it was for our grandparents when they were young.

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  • #59794

    I tend to think kinks are kinks.

    If you are into them or not isn’t hugely reliant on attitudes or accessibility. In the early 90s they used to send a catalogue out in the UK called ‘Transformation’ (despite the title it wasn’t particularly about transgender ideas although they may have included some). They had adult men wearing nappies/diapers, a lot of domination and BDSM stuff. It never floated my boat then and doesn’t now when I could call up that material on a free porn site.

    I don’t really get that stuff, I have no desire for candles to be melted on me or stilettos walking over my body, but whether I do or not people have been doing it forever, the very earliest 20th century porn has a lot of spanking and things like that. I’m sure they didn’t invent it but were the first to have a method to record it.

    I think that the reduction in actual sex is partly due to the availability of porn. Along with the addition of more distractions. For most people your physical desires are sated at least temporarily by masturbation, porn allows men to do that with women of physical beauty most could never attract in real life. Probably for women too but I can’t say with authority there.

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  • #59802

    Interesting conversation so far…😂

  • #59805

    Less alcohol consumption and more time playing computer games – Red Dead Redemption is more attractive than hooking up at a club. Young people these day!

    Ironically, people thought videogames would lead to greater sex and violence in society. Both are in decline.

     

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  • #59816

    I tend to think kinks are kinks. If you are into them or not isn’t hugely reliant on attitudes or accessibility.

    To some degree maybe. Many sexual kinks are formed at a young age, hence the popularity of such things as school uniforms, the diaper thing etc. In the years after the second world war, there was a fetish for gas masks because kids were issued with them and had to wear them during air-raids. Often sexuality is linked to a feeling of security and familiarity.

    However, I think the accessibility of porn means that people’s sexual tastes can get more extreme over time, when the usual “attractive woman with big breasts” (or whatever your baseline turn-on is) no longer has the desired effect.

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  • #59817

    Of the possible explanations considered, the decline in the formation of romantic relationships and decreasing alcohol consumption are the most important

    So drink more is have more sex? I like this strategy!

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  • #59924

    Red Dead Redemption is more attractive than hooking up at a club. Young people these day!

    Well, it’s certainly easier, at least.

    Ironically, people thought videogames would lead to greater sex and violence in society. Both are in decline.

    Heh. Yeah, good point.

  • #61018

    This time, it’s for real:

    Jennifer Lopez and Alex Rodriguez Announce They’ve Broken Up

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  • #61019

    This time, it’s for real:

    Jennifer Lopez and Alex Rodriguez Announce They’ve Broken Up

    For a moment, I thought Chris Rock and his wife divorced.

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  • #61054

    Speaking of relationships…. HAPPY BIRTHDAY TO GARETH JONES!!!!!

    5 users thanked author for this post.
  • #61735

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  • #62190

    For a moment, I thought Chris Rock and his wife divorced.

    A running joke headed by @todd and @njerry

    Regarding Chris Rock: Early in his standup career, he used to joke about this scenario of dating and making out with a woman. Things start to get hot and heavy when all of a sudden, she puts on the breaks, says it doesn’t feel right, and asks the guy to stop. Rock would say about how the man is ready but not to stop so sudden. Needless to say, a few women groups complained, the media also gave him flack for it and Chris, reading the room, stopped the routine and changed his material.

    —————————-

    While we are on the subject of celebrities:

    In the early 2000s Leonardo Dicaprio used to go with a few friends to clubs “Entourage” style. They called themselves The pu**y posse. (You can Google the term and get all these articles about it.)

    Now in recent years, he goes out with these young lingerie and swimsuit models and dumps them when they turn 25 or so for another model who is younger, even though he is in his early forties and has a “dad bod”. The models apparently go with him for the press and notoriety, and he… well… I guess they deserve each other.

    ——————————

    In contrast, this is Keanu Reeves in recent years:

    https://www.nbcnews.com/pop-culture/celebrity/what-keanu-reeves-dating-age-appropriate-alexandra-grant-reveals-about-n1076756

    191105-alexandra-grant-keanu-reeves-al-1459_59100841298e7f5b709b539b7913d81d.fit-2000w

    Granted, she isn’t Victoria Secret material or Instragram hot, but Keanu gets credit and big thumbs up from others.

    —————————-

    If you are googling:

    Google Tyrese

    I have no comment… or words.

    ‘Nuff said

  • #62268

    25344010-D797-4E78-9341-206355E3FC39

    4CC19C63-6088-4BC5-AF9F-36B0D2AB7D2A

    A613EDA3-602E-4F56-8F39-1281506EB79B

  • #62449

    This time, I will beat @jrcarter to the punch with this news link:

    https://people.com/human-interest/bill-gates-melinda-gates-announce-divorce-after-27-years-of-marriage/?utm_campaign=peoplemagazine&utm_content=manual&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=609063955510bd00018569e5&fbclid=IwAR2dvcC7LprfQqiqQr6fscc8FhdSLlSl__VHBtlGg61wDggV3wU82g8_KSY

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