DC Movies & TV discussion

Topic

Talk about all live-action and animated DC stuff here.

Replies

Contrarianist jokes aside, I would very much like seeing Elliot Page in this role. Although after playing Kitty Pride and Boltie, maybe he’s fed up with superheroics.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Sean Robinson

Prediction:

Nicolas Cage is playing Superman in The Flash.

I say this because in a recent interview, he was asked something about his Superman role that never happened, and subsequently asked if it was possible for him to return to that.

His reply was along these lines: “Does it matter for how long I’m in the movie? It might not be too late.”

I’m pretty sure about this. Like I was about Luke having turned to the dark side in The Last Jedi, but with the difference that I’m right this time.

5 users thanked author for this post.

Christian, Sean Robinson, Todd, Dave

JRCarter wrote:

Apparently, there’s a fan movement to have Elliot Page replace Ezra Miller as the Flash.

At least, a few news sites are reporting there is a fan movement for Eliot Page to replace Ezra Miller. However, I’m sure that if you scoured twitter, facebook, instagram and the whole of social media, you could convincingly find enough people to report anything, and popular character casting has a lot of PR manipulation anyway.

WB Studio Head: Listen, guys, we need to recast Flash with an actor that won’t attract a planet-sized amount of controversy. Who’s the first one that comes to mind?

Casting agent 1: Eliot Page is getting a lot of attention lately. What about him?

Castin agent 2: Yeah, that would be really controversial. Good idea.

WB Studio Head: Is anyone actually listening to me?

On the other hand, Page is a good actor, and would emphasize the Flash dynamic of speed and intelligence over brute force.

 

1 user thanked author for this post.

Given the multiversal angle of the Flash movie, I imagine the plot relies to quite a signficant extent on the lead character being the same Flash from the Snyderverse movies.

So recasting of any kind would muddy those waters somewhat and potentially wreck the entire premise of the film.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Dave wrote:

So recasting of any kind would muddy those waters somewhat and potentially wreck the entire premise of the film.

Thanks to Ezra Miller, I think we are way beyond the point of worrying about a coherent plot in a superhero movie.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Uncle Retrospective

Dave wrote:

So recasting of any kind would muddy those waters somewhat and potentially wreck the entire premise of the film.

If anything, that’s the writers job. Not the executives.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Sean Robinson

Todd wrote:

Dave wrote:

So recasting of any kind would muddy those waters somewhat and potentially wreck the entire premise of the film.

Thanks to Ezra Miller, I think we are way beyond the point of worrying about a coherent plot in a superhero movie.

You spelled Zack Snyder wrong.

6 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle, Todd, njerry, Bruce

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

2 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle, Todd

Ezra Miller? Replacement justified. If there is a movement for Eliot Page, go for it. Spend the money and get it done.

This is a fucking trainwreck they do not need. Shit happened, now do the right thing.

Don’t care if his name isn’t in the top three, he can’t be the Flash in a Flash movie.
Period.

For fuck sake.
Why do they make more money than I do?
All kinds of wrong.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Todd

JRCarter wrote:

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

That is strange. I don’t recall if there was any backlash reported. Does anyone remember the stories from the first season? I wonder if there was any backlash to Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl?

Sean Robinson wrote:

Why do they make more money than I do?

Sell your iPhone and stop buying avocado toast. Then eat the rich.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Uncle Retrospective, Sean Robinson, Todd

Sean Robinson wrote:

Ezra Miller? Replacement justified. If there is a movement for Eliot Page, go for it. Spend the money and get it done.

Replacing a controversial person with another controversial person seems like a dumb move, tbh.

I do wonder how Keaton is feeling right about now… =P

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Anonymous wrote:

JRCarter wrote:

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

That is strange. I don’t recall if there was any backlash reported. Does anyone remember the stories from the first season? I wonder if there was any backlash to Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl?

I remember reading some stuff when they cast Patton as Iris. Some “fans” were upset that they made the character black instead of keeping her white like in the comics. There was definitely some negativity towards the casting.

Being at the center of it all, it sounds like she experienced far more than was reported at the time.

1 user thanked author for this post.

JRCarter

Todd wrote:

I remember reading some stuff when they cast Patton as Iris. Some “fans” were upset that they made the character black instead of keeping her white like in the comics. There was definitely some negativity towards the casting. Being at the center of it all, it sounds like she experienced far more than was reported at the time.

There was a big racist attack on the black actress (Moses Ingram) in the Obi Wan series and before that, the black actress (Lashana Lynch) in the James Bond movie.

Afraid it is getting worse…

2 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, JRCarter

Anonymous wrote:

JRCarter wrote:

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

That is strange. I don’t recall if there was any backlash reported. Does anyone remember the stories from the first season? I wonder if there was any backlash to Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl?

I remember there was backlash. at the time, I was not conducive to it because DC had just replaced OG Wally West with the black Wallace West and I was not happy. It was the typical, over the top, incel, racist bullshit that is quite hurtful.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Well, to be fair, the “racist” backlash is always mixed in with the “purist” backlash, and both are usually waaaay overblown.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Rocket

Rocket wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

JRCarter wrote:

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

That is strange. I don’t recall if there was any backlash reported. Does anyone remember the stories from the first season? I wonder if there was any backlash to Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl?

I remember there was backlash. at the time, I was not conducive to it because DC had just replaced OG Wally West with the black Wallace West and I was not happy. It was the typical, over the top, incel, racist bullshit that is quite hurtful.

I had no problem with black Jimmy Olsen because the actor was super-charismatic and likeable, and the character was a good extrapolation of what a grown-up Jimmy might be like.

I had no major problem with black Iris, though the character was a bit annoying.

I disliked black Wally because the character was annoying in every way.

I’m not sure where this puts me on the racism or purism spectrums.

I don’t consider myself a purist when it comes to the TV shows because they are not really adaptations of the core stories and characters. They are more like an Elseworlds, where some elements stay the same and others change to fit the milieu.

3 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, Todd

DavidM wrote:

Rocket wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

JRCarter wrote:

‘The Flash’ star Candice Patton slams Warner Bros, The CW for doing NOTHING to protect her from abuse

That is strange. I don’t recall if there was any backlash reported. Does anyone remember the stories from the first season? I wonder if there was any backlash to Jimmy Olsen in Supergirl?

I remember there was backlash. at the time, I was not conducive to it because DC had just replaced OG Wally West with the black Wallace West and I was not happy. It was the typical, over the top, incel, racist bullshit that is quite hurtful.

I had no problem with black Jimmy Olsen because the actor was super-charismatic and likeable, and the character was a good extrapolation of what a grown-up Jimmy might be like.

I had no major problem with black Iris, though the character was a bit annoying.

I disliked black Wally because the character was annoying in every way.

I’m not sure where this puts me on the racism or purism spectrums.

I don’t consider myself a purist when it comes to the TV shows because they are not really adaptations of the core stories and characters. They are more like an Elseworlds, where some elements stay the same and others change to fit the milieu.

I think your dislikes aren’t racist or purist. It sounds more like you didn’t care for the writing for the characters and possibly, the actors’ performances.

1 user thanked author for this post.

On Instagram, Bruna Marquezine posted a new image from ‘BLUE BEETLE’ set with Xolo Maridueña. from DCEUleaks

What an unprecedented shock:

Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

3 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Uncle Retrospective, Dave

lorcan_nagle wrote:

What an unprecedented shock:

Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

3 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, Todd, lorcan_nagle

lorcan_nagle wrote:

What an unprecedented shock:

Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

2 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, lorcan_nagle

lorcan_nagle wrote:

What an unprecedented shock:

Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

3 users thanked author for this post.

Bruce, Todd, lorcan_nagle

lorcan_nagle wrote:

What an unprecedented shock: Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

Yeah, it’s shocking we’re in mid 2022 and they’re still doing hit pieces on Snyder and the snydercut folks… like fuckin’ let it go already.

Oh, also, that article is really trash… just full of nonsensical accusations made by “unnamed sources”… bullshit. But hey, you guys can eat it up, I guess…

Plus, how curious that article was conveniently all ready to go right before the release date of the snydercut on digital… it’s almost as if it was a planned hitpiece…

Edit: Oh look, even Forbes is calling bs…

https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2022/07/19/warner-bros-claims-about-a-bot-infested-snyder-cut-movement-dont-really-add-up/?sh=48d6a2c217f5

lorcan_nagle wrote:

What an unprecedented shock:

Exclusive: Fake Accounts Fueled the ‘Snyder Cut’ Online Army

I agree with [insert name of above poster], it’s shocking we’re in mid 2022 and they’re still doing hit pieces on Snyder and the snydercut folks… like fuckin’ let it go already.

Also that article is really trash.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Christian, DavidM

Glad to see you’re still as petty and pathetic as always.

Jon wrote:

Edit: Oh look, even Forbes is calling bs… https://www.forbes.com/sites/paultassi/2022/07/19/warner-bros-claims-about-a-bot-infested-snyder-cut-movement-dont-really-add-up/?sh=48d6a2c217f5%5B/quote%5D

Maybe I’m missing something, but it doesn’t seem like that article actually counters the Rolling Stone research, just seeks to downplay it.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, lorcan_nagle

I mean, you can’t have it both ways. These Snyder bros have been non stop since 2017. Even when they got what they wanted, they switched their hashtag and continued on. But when we some criticism all of a sudden people should just “let it go” and move on🤨.

I personally don’t give a shit about the bots. But the bullying and harassment is completely out of order. Especially when they and Snyder like to boast about their suicide prevention charity work. It’s real fuckin scummy to me.

5 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Dave, Bruce, lorcan_nagle

Dave wrote:

Maybe I’m missing something, but it doesn’t seem like that article actually counters the Rolling Stone research, just seeks to downplay it.

Right, so they’re calling bs on the sensationalism of the RS article… never said they countered it.

Ian Smith wrote:

I personally don’t give a shit about the bots. But the bullying and harassment is completely out of order. Especially when they and Snyder like to boast about their suicide prevention charity work. It’s real fuckin scummy to me.

Ah yes, we’re back to pretending only the snydercut fandom has toxic people in it… or is it to generalizing a whole bunch of people under the same blanket statement? I can’t keep track…

Ah well, thank god the Star Wars fandom is full of amazing people who never do any horrible shit…

Also, funny how no one ever calls out the toxic harrasment by some clowns in here.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Al-x

I’m not saying every fandom doesn’t have their toxic sides, but do we really need to play what about this fandom?, or what about that fandom?. Other fans being shite doesn’t excuse the toxic elements of the Snyder fans.

Going on my personal experience, I’ve never interacted with a Snyder fan that can have a normal conversation about him. For them every movie he’s made is a masterpiece, they have no flaws and his “vision” is the only thing that can save the DC movies…Oh, they also believe he actually won an Oscar. And if you dare to suggest he’s not a golden gold, well, you’re just a Marvel fanboy that’s somehow jealous🤨.

4 users thanked author for this post.

njerry, Todd, Dave, lorcan_nagle

Yeah, I was gonna type an answer, but you know what? I don’t fuckin care. Though it’s funny how you complain about the Snyder fans by doing the same thing you’re accusing them of doing… The anti-Snyder crowd is every bit as pathetic as the hardcore Snyder fanboys, that’s the reality.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Al-x

The Snyder vs anti-Snyder stuff is all pretty silly. I don’t particularly like his movies and probably never will, but I feel like both sides can get so combative that they push each other to the extremes. Can I say which group was the first mover? Nope. Doesn’t really matter. My take on the guy is he’s talented with some great visual sensibilities who picks projects that I SHOULD be predisposed to enjoy…but his movies are generally void of emotion and coherent storytelling. They are dour films that can be a slog to get through despite his eye for cool aesthetics. And I still think Sucker Punch is one of the grossest, most dull movies I’ve ever watched. But no one is forcing me to watch his movies so if others like that stuff, good for them and Snyder I suppose. I just try to avoid the super fans.

Dude can often put together a cool trailer though.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Dave, DavidM

Chris D wrote:

Can I say which group was the first mover? Nope. Doesn’t really matter.

Well, I hope your answer would the correct one, because we’re all old enough in here to know better. The guy’s been shit on pretty hard since Dawn of the Dead, aka his very first movie… xD

I can understand the younger people getting bamboozled by the narrative that “people only dislike Snyder because of his rabid fanbase”, but that’s just bullshit.

Jon wrote:

I can understand the younger people getting bamboozled by the narrative that “people only dislike Snyder because of his rabid fanbase”, but that’s just bullshit.

I agree, there’s loads of other reasons.

4 users thanked author for this post.

njerry, lorcan_nagle, Chris D, Todd

Quite why any people get that worked up about a movie or a director escapes me. I mean, what is this, Star Wars?

4 users thanked author for this post.

Rocket, njerry, Todd, lorcan_nagle

Jon wrote:

Chris D wrote:

Can I say which group was the first mover? Nope. Doesn’t really matter.

Well, I hope your answer would the correct one, because we’re all old enough in here to know better. The guy’s been shit on pretty hard since Dawn of the Dead, aka his very first movie… xD

I can understand the younger people getting bamboozled by the narrative that “people only dislike Snyder because of his rabid fanbase”, but that’s just bullshit.

If you say so. I’m sure you’re right. But WhatI remember about his first couple of movies was a lot of people heaping praise on him. Especially after 300. So I’d wager that, at the very least, his haters and fans arose simultaneously. Which isn’t surprising. Why wouldn’t they? Dawn of the Dead was both very well received by many, but I’m sure it was also disliked by a lot of people comparing it to the original Dawn of the Dead and possibly to 28 Days Later since they came out pretty close together. But can I say which group got more rabid first? No. And I could take your word for it, but you have a clear bias here too. End of the day I still don’t see why it matters. Some people love his movies, some can’t stand them. Either way he’s more successful than basically anyone arguing either side will ever be. So he wins. And his fans win. Because he gets to keep making movies.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, lorcan_nagle

saga wrote:

Quite why any people get that worked up about a movie or a director escapes me. I mean, what is this, Star Wars?

Fuck me if I know, I rarely mention the guy unless there’s big news or other people mention him… you should ask Lorcan, he seems to be obsessed…

1 user thanked author for this post.

[Todd]

saga wrote:

Quite why any people get that worked up about a movie or a director escapes me. I mean, what is this, Star Wars?

Wait, this isn’t about Star Trek?

• This reply was modified 2 years, 4 months ago by Todd.

2 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle

Snyder has become something of an odd champion in the “give fans what they want” debate which in itself is absurd. Like there is this group of people out there demanding people should suffer when they go to a movie – they should be punished!

Which is a little ironic considering how painful it can be to sit through many Zack Snyder movies.

It’s all projection from extreme ends, but on top of that, I’m sure a few people at Warner Bros. felt directly attacked and put in bad positions by the “Snyder Cut” movement and though Hollywood may be short on talent or ethics, it really runs on petty vindictiveness and manufactured scandal neither of which are ever in short supply.

Oh, and the corruption of innocence, of course. It runs on that too.

 

3 users thanked author for this post.

Chris D, Todd, lorcan_nagle

The way movies are made is basically – someone has an idea, literally hundreds if not thousands of other people wind up getting involved in some capacity and eventually, maybe, there is an end product that appears years down the line. Frankly, it is a miracle that any of them are any good.

4 users thanked author for this post.

Chris D, Todd, lorcan_nagle

So… From Jim Lee at SDCC:

Jim Lee, legendary comic-book artist and CCO of DC Comics, confirms that there are no plans for Zack Snyder to return or for the SnyderVerse to continue.pic.twitter.com/zAWBVvbQts

— One Take News (@OneTakeNews) July 21, 2022

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Anonymous wrote:

Snyder has become something of an odd champion in the “give fans what they want” debate which in itself is absurd.

That would be Paramount’s Sonic… =P

1 user thanked author for this post.

Out next week on HBO Max.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Well, that looks generic as fuck… hope it’s just a case of “bad trailering”.

I did notice the veeeery careful editing to not show Ezra Miller’s face though… xD

1 user thanked author for this post.

Chris-S

Netflix’s Sandman trailer: The Dream is finally real (avclub.com)

More importantly, though, Gaiman, David S. Goyer, and Allan Heinberg seem to have nailed the sweeping, surreal scope and tone of Sandman, with shots of Hell, the realm of Dream’s sibling Desire, and one very unlucky diner all exuding the proper sense of mystery and dread. (We also get a quick bit of David Thewlis as the resident of said diner, and, yeah: This is probably going to be a creepy one.)

I posted the chart listing for Marvel.

Now here is the latest one for DC:

Why is Sandman, as a DC property, on Netflix anyway?  Is this some other convoluted rights issue?

Not really that convoluted, as movie development stalled for Sandman, WB signed a deal with Netflix to produce the TV series, partly due to the costs involved for such a high-budget show.

Well, this is what could have been:

Peters was a producer for a planned adaptation of the Sandman comics for Warner Bros., which became stuck in development in 2001. Sandman creator Neil Gaiman called the last screenplay for the film that Warner Bros. would send him “not only the worst Sandman script I’ve ever seen, but quite easily the worst script I’ve ever read.” In a 2005 interview regarding the film, Gaiman commented: “But Sandman movies, they just got increasingly appalling… They started out hiring some really good people… And then Jon Peters fired all of them and got in some people who take orders, and who wanted fistfights and all this stuff. It had no sensibility… they were horrible.”

(From the wikipedia-page for producer Jon Peters.)

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Thanks to Kevin Smith, I can’t read the name Jon Peters and not think “giant spider.”

3 users thanked author for this post.

Bruce, Todd, Uncle Retrospective

‘Harley Quinn’ Showrunners Patrick Schumacker & Justin Halpern on the Future of Harlivy and the Bat Family in Season 3 – Exclusive Interview

The Peters thing is very long ago but I agree the Sandman on Netflix thing isn’t necessarily that convoluted. They wanted to make it, Warners were fine to give them the option. They’ll want to keep the majority of IP on HBO Max but they won’t have an unlimited budget and that means licensing is still an option.

It remains an option for everyone, say Disney have no plans to make a Strikeforce Morituri or The ‘Nam series and a network asks they could well say yes, it’s turning down free money really if you don’t. The only reason to decline really would be if they are fundamentalist about control (which to be fair Disney often are). Even in the comics though while they brought a lot of stuff in-house after the Disney purchase and then the Fox one they also do license some stuff out to IDW, DK and Abrams.

‘The Flash’ to End With Abbreviated Season 9 on The CW

I have now watched Zack Snyder’s Justice League.

What I liked:
Seeing more of Darkseid and Apocalips, as well as the functioning of the mother boxes.

What I didn’t like:
Everything expanding on any of the core characters. It was all entirely boring, bland dialogue.

The expanded fight scenes and visual moments and whatnot… those were okay, but honestly I was kind of bored by them in the way I was bored watching Sucker Punch. None of it felt relevant or particularly entertaining to me.

Honestly, having seen all of this and whatever the faults of the Whedon/Snyder hybrid cinematic release, that one was a better movie simply on account of having momentum and not being so fucking boring. Whedon was right to cut all of that stuff, especially the Cyborg story.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Chris-S

Welp, time to reset the Snyder counter…

6 users thanked author for this post.

Christian, Todd, Uncle Retrospective, Dave, lorcan_nagle

#RestoreTheSnyderCounter

6 users thanked author for this post.

Christian, DavidM, lorcan_nagle, njerry, Todd

What DC character should he play? from DC_Cinematic

“Batgirl,” the feature film adaptation of the DC Comics character, has been killed at Warner Bros., Variety has confirmed. It will not premiere on any platform at the studio — neither theatrically nor on HBO Max.

The $90 million production — starring Leslie Grace as Barbara Gordon (aka Batgirl) and directed by “Bad Boys for Life” and “Ms. Marvel” filmmakers Adil El Arbi and Bilall Fallah — was greenlit in 2021 as part of a company-wide effort at Warner Bros. to create feature films specifically for HBO Max. But the new corporate regime at Warner Bros. Discovery has pivoted the company’s priorities back to theatrical features, leaving “Batgirl” without a proper home.

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/batgirl-not-released-warner-bros-hbo-max-1235331897/

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/batgirl-shelved-at-warner-bros-hbo-max-1235191371/

Fun times at WB

 

3 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, Todd, Ian Smith

[Ian Smith]

Christ, this big Michael Keaton return to the bat suit is going well isn’t it?..😬

• This reply was modified 2 years, 4 months ago by Ian Smith.

4 users thanked author for this post.

Rocket, JRCarter, Todd

Man, Warners is such as shit show. They manage to get Keaton back as Batman in 2 movies and they’re actually shelving one completely while somehow moving forward with the other that’s saddled with a lead hellbent on destroying themselves and everything they come in contact with. Absolutely mind boggling.

4 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle, JRCarter, Todd, Ben

Chris D wrote:

Man, Warners is such as shit show. They manage to get Keaton back as Batman in 2 movies and they’re actually shelving one completely while somehow moving forward with the other that’s saddled with a lead hellbent on destroying themselves and everything they come in contact with. Absolutely mind boggling.

It’s coming to something when Amber Heard’s new DC movie is looking like a PR dream in comparison.

6 users thanked author for this post.

garjones, Chris D, lorcan_nagle, Todd, JRCarter

JRCarter wrote:

What DC character should he play? from DC_Cinematic

The Creeper.

However, if he went for Marvel (who would blame him?), I think he’d be a great Moleman.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Chris D wrote:

Man, Warners is such as shit show.

This is the correct answer.

4 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Rocket, Bruce, lorcan_nagle

[paul f]

Why Warner Bros. Killed ‘Batgirl’: Inside the Decision Not to Release the DC Movie

According to sources with knowledge of the situation, the most likely reason: taxes.

Even before David Zaslav took the reins of the newly formed Warner Bros. Discovery as CEO this spring, the exec went on a well-publicized listening tour designed to repair the company’s relationship with the creative community. As part of that effort, Zaslav has made no secret of reversing Kilar’s strategy and committing to releasing first-run feature films in theaters before putting them on HBO Max.

“Batgirl” found itself on the bad end of that decision, apparently neither big enough to feel worthy of a major theatrical release nor small enough to make economic sense in an increasingly cutthroat streaming landscape. Spending the money to expand the scope of “Batgirl” for theaters — plus the $30 million to $50 million needed to market it domestically and the tens of millions more needed for a global rollout — could have nearly doubled spending on the film, and insiders say that was a non-starter at a company newly focused on belt-tightening and the bottom line. (Spokespeople for Warner Bros. and Warner Bros. Discovery declined to comment for this story.)

Releasing the movie on HBO Max would seem to be the most obvious solution. Instead, the company has shelved “Batgirl” — along with the “Scoob!” sequel — and several sources say it will almost certainly take a tax write-down on both films, seen internally as the most financially sound way to recoup the costs (at least, on an accountant’s ledger). It could justify that by chalking it up to a post-merger change of strategy.

Ugh.

• This reply was modified 2 years, 4 months ago by paul f.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Chris D wrote:

Man, Warners is such as shit show. They manage to get Keaton back as Batman in 2 movies and they’re actually shelving one completely while somehow moving forward with the other that’s saddled with a lead hellbent on destroying themselves and everything they come in contact with. Absolutely mind boggling.

Kevin Spacey is the Flash, coming 2023.

4 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, Todd, njerry

We’re like a year away from MoS’s 10th year anniversary… so 9 years in which they haven’t been able to get a fuckin’ Superman movie off the ground despite having a beloved actor on deck… so yes, “shit show” is one way to put it.

3 users thanked author for this post.

JRCarter, Rocket

Larry Young posted this on Facebook:

[JRCarter]

Forgot the link was already posted.

• This reply was modified 2 years, 4 months ago by JRCarter.

This is not my beautiful Batgirl

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Todd Phillips’ ‘Joker: Folie À Deux’ Gets Fall 2024 Release Date

Looking forward to WB cancelling this in a couple of years.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Ben

Love the optimism.  Couple of years he says….

2 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Dave

Ben wrote:

Love the optimism.  Couple of years he says….

Well they’ve got to make it before they cancel it! Be stupid to cancel a movie before it even exists.

3 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle, Todd

Dave wrote:

Looking forward to WB cancelling this in a couple of years.

It is an interesting business model when it leads a movie studio to not release a movie they’ve practically already made. Though, I imagine there are dozens every year that are shelved. DC had a similar fiasco when they cancelled a well-received Swamp Thing series after tax credits were denied.

It’s basically show business and The Producers was not far off when it comes to the contradictory nature of money manipulation. This is why the studios moved all the production companies off their lots and replaced them with offices filled by contract and IP lawyers and accountants.

Michael Keaton should’ve just said no.

It is uncertain what they want to do with the material. Aquaman, Shazam and Black Adam are more like Marvel movies – and pretty much set in the Snyderverse – while Joker and Batman were more like Nolan’s movies. Batgirl seems like it was going for a throwback to the 80’s Batman style, maybe…?

At the same time, they were either good movies and/or successful, so don’t know why they don’t just keep putting movies out. That is the one thing I think they should copy from Marvel. Just keep getting the material out to the public. Doesn’t matter if it relates or ties together.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

Batgirl Star Breaks Silence About Cancelled DC Movie

Hollywood Reporter saying what I have for a long time:

Warner Bros. wants so badly to be where Marvel Studios is, but it lacks the patience and understanding of its characters to ever get there. It wants billion-dollar hits without making $300 million hits first. 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-features/batgirl-cancellation-dc-movies-1235192230/

3 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, lorcan_nagle, njerry

Kind of a silly thing for that article to say when the last two Nolan Batman movies each made more than a billion dollars, and BvS made almost that, and Aquaman and Joker also both cleared the $1bn mark.

The issue isn’t the scale of the takings of these movies, particularly – if anything, the financial woes are more a budget issue (when a movie like BvS that makes a billion dollars is still unprofitable, something has gone wrong somewhere).

Where DC/WB lag badly behind Marvel is any kind of strong, coherent vision or joined-up approach to the movies, and no apparent quality control. It all feels completely scattershot, to the extent that the big hits (and there have been a few) feel more accidental than anything else.

The badly-paced lack-of-gradual-build-up aspect is part of it (and felt really clunky in BvS), but let’s not forget there were only five MCU movies before Avengers and only a four-year gap between that and the first Iron Man – and they were already trailing Avengers at the end of that first MCU movie.

It’s not like it needs to take a decade to make an Avengers-level hit, it just needs some thought and careful planning put into it.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Chris-S, njerry

This is also from that article:

It wants all the marquee characters assembled without building up a world of supporting B- and C-level characters that audiences care about.

Again, this is kind of a weird thing to say when the next DC/WB movies are Aquaman, a Shazam sequel and a Super-pets animated movie, and arguably the breakout DCEU character has been Harley Quinn.

The issue isn’t WB only wanting Superman and Batman movies and neglecting the lower-tier characters – Gunn’s Suicide Squad was pretty much all Z-listers and Aquaman was a longtime punchline synonymous with crap superheroes before his movie came out.

The issue – in simple terms – is making good films that people enjoy.

1 user thanked author for this post.

njerry

Anonymous wrote:

It is uncertain what they want to do with the material. Aquaman, Shazam and Black Adam are more like Marvel movies – and pretty much set in the Snyderverse – while Joker and Batman were more like Nolan’s movies. Batgirl seems like it was going for a throwback to the 80’s Batman style, maybe…?

The problem with Batgirl is that it relies on the Flash movie to introduce Keaton’s Batman… and whatever changes were gonna happen, because her dad is the Snyderverse Gordon, so it’s still tied to it somehow… probably why they’re “shelving” it too, since they need to figure out what the fuck to do with that whole Flash mess first, I reckon.

It’s all silly, one the one side the studio saying the Snyderverse is done while clearly, except for Joker and The Batman, everything else is still set in that universe… and on the other side people clamoring for the restoring of the Snyderverse when it never really went anywhere… it’s just a jumbled mess of narratives.

My guess is Zaslav is gonna push for a clean slate once Shazam 2, Black Adam and Aquaman 2 are released… I doubt they want to piss either Momoa or Johnson (particularly the later) by not releasing those movies. It’d be interesting to know what the Rock’s contract looks like, because I doubt it’s just for one movie.

That said, I don’t think they’ll mess with Joker 2 or The Batman 2, since they’re self contained, plus they were both succesful… but I could see the Batman 2 being cancelled if Zaslav wants to go hard… not the Joker 2 though, that shit made waaaaay too much money to be cancelled.

Dave wrote:

Kind of a silly thing for that article to say when the last two Nolan Batman movies each made more than a billion dollars, and BvS made almost that, and Aquaman and Joker also both cleared the $1bn mark.

I really don’t think it is. The two are connected.

Yes the Nolan films were massive box office hits, largely standalone, Bale’s Batman has appeared in no films since, but the strategy after that has been really hap hazard.

Dave wrote:

Where DC/WB lag badly behind Marvel is any kind of strong, coherent vision or joined-up approach to the movies, and no apparent quality control. It all feels completely scattershot, to the extent that the big hits (and there have been a few) feel more accidental than anything else.

This is the to me the same problem, Marvel had some pretty mediocre showings, they may do with the next movie, but it tends to pay off in the end. A Tim Roth cameo for She-Hulk gets fan gasps because they stuck with ideas through a mediocre box office showing. DC could never wait for a Superman sequel, they jumped into combos hoping for Avengers billions and fell short. Not because all the movies are bad but Marvel had more patience to tell the story.

The article articulates its point poorly though by talking about box office and how DC want to get to billion-dollar movies without going through movies that made hundreds of millions first.

Because they actually did do exactly that – Man of Steel and BvS and Suicide Squad and Wonder Woman all made box office in the (high) hundreds of millions of dollars and introduced a fairly broad cast that mixed A-listers with C-listers.

Justice League didn’t fail because DC hadn’t done those things – they demonstrably did. It failed because people thought it was a bit shit, largely because of the creative mess WB/DC were in at the time.

Marvel didn’t take 10 movies to get to Avengers. They had two Iron Man movies, and a single Hulk, Cap and Thor movie each. Not that different to DC’s four. Where DC/WB failed is they made it too transparent (within BvS in particular) that they were chasing after that Avengers style group as the main goal, rather than letting the audience feel like it happened organically.

Which to be honest the MCU was guilty of early on too (Iron Man 2 was slated for this very reason).

It feels really boring and obvious to say it, but DC just didn’t make movies that people enjoyed as much as the MCU films. And that’s as much down to a thousand small creative decisions as any big sweeping differences in how the studios put the overarching franchise together.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Chris-S

I think there are some stretches there. DC did Man of Steel, no Batman movie, rushed to BvS which has a WW cameo where neither party knows who she is (it’s a joke line in the trailer).

It’s not necessarily numbers of films, albeit that is part of it,  but narrative flow.

Suicide Squad is irrelevant as it has no connection to Justice League. All the character moments in the DC path fail because they have no previous connection. “He’s my friend” doesn’t work because he isn’t and tried to kill him 5 minutes earlier, Wonder Woman appealing to ‘Kal-El’ doesn’t because there is no on-screen point she even knows who he is.

Endgame pays off because all those character moments have been set up, even as trivial as ‘on your left’.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Ben

There’s how many dead shared universes at this point? DC tried to do it and failed.  Cruise’s The Mummy was supposed to start one off, it didn’t.  It’s akin to how after the success of Babylon 5, everyone started talking of doing a 5-year arc, massively underestimated what it involved and failed.

At this point we’re all used to looking at Marvel movies as both individual film and, somehow, a piece of a bigger tale.

DC keep thinking they want that, but their films would probably work better without it.  Aquaman? Minimal links.  Shazam? I think zero? The Batman? Zero.

Plus by not being distracted by all the demands of creating some big continuity, they can focus on doing stories that don’t require the creative sleight of hand / shortcuts that BvS does.

garjones wrote:

It’s not necessarily numbers of films, albeit that is part of it,  but narrative flow. Suicide Squad is irrelevant as it has no connection to Justice League. All the character moments in the DC path fail because they have no previous connection. “He’s my friend” doesn’t work because he isn’t and tried to kill him 5 minutes earlier, Wonder Woman appealing to ‘Kal-El’ doesn’t because there is no on-screen point she even knows who he is. Endgame pays off because all those character moments have been set up, even as trivial as ‘on your left’.

I think we’re pretty much on the same page with all this stuff. The issue is creative decisions, not the size of the budgets or the box-office takings, which was the point originally being made.

I don’t think anyone could argue against the point that the DCEU has been creatively mismanaged. And the lack of a coherent approach means there’s no sense of overarching narrative to drive the whole thing forward. So each movie basically succeeds or fails on its own merits rather than being carried by the overall brand like the MCU movies all are to some extent.

1 user thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle

DC Will Have 10-Year Plan Akin to Marvel’s Playbook, Says David Zaslav – Hollywood reporter

The Warner Bros. Discovery executive also addressed scrapping ‘Batgirl’: “Our job is to protect the DC brand.”

Just two days after Warner Bros. Discovery made the stunning move to cancel the HBO Max film Batgirl, an unapologetic CEO David Zaslav sought to reassure Wall Street there is a cohesive plan for the future of DC.

“You look at Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, Aquaman — these are brands that are known everywhere in the world,” Zaslav said during an earnings call Thursday. “We have done a reset. We’ve restructured the business where we are going to focus, where there is going to be a team with a 10-year plan focusing just on DC. We believe we can build a much more sustainable business.”

DC has long wished to emulate the success of the Disney-owned Marvel Studios, which Kevin Feige has built into the highest-grossing film franchise in history. Zaslav recently brought Feige’s former boss, retired Disney film chief Alan Horn, on as an adviser. During the earnings call, Zaslav suggested DC would try to emulate the Marvel playbook.

“It’s very similar to the structure Alan Horn, [former Disney CEO] Bob Iger and Kevin Feige put together very effectively at Disney. We think we can build a much stronger, sustainable growth business out of DC,” said Zaslav. “As part of that, we are going to focus on quality. We are not going to release any film before it’s ready. … DC is something we can make better.”

DC has proceeded in stops and starts following the conclusion of Christopher Nolan’s defining Dark Knight trilogy concluded a decade ago. The studio initially tapped Zack Snyder to oversee its planned universe, which the filmmaker launched in 2013 with Man of Steel. However, Snyder lost the confidence of studio executives after the divisive 2016 Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice, and some of the films in an ambitious 10-project slate announced in 2014 never came to fruition, including Justice League 2. Executive Walter Hamada took the reins of DC Films in 2018 and has been plotting out a number of films — including several for HBO Max to meet the mandate of then-WarnerMedia CEO Jason Kilar. Now those plans are changing once again.

Zaslav touted a number of DC films coming up, including Black Adam and Shazam! Fury of the Gods, and addressed rumors that some of those films could shift dates without confirming or denying any specifics.

“We are very excited about them. We’ve seen them. We think they are terrific, and we think we can make them even better,” Zaslav said in terms of marketing and distributing the upcoming films, which also include The Flash, starring controversial actor Ezra Miller.

Miller was accused of choking a fan in Iceland in April 2020, and Business Insider published a report Thursday featuring a lengthy interview with the parents of an 18-year-old who say the actor had groomed their child since they were 12. Warners’ plans for The Flash, which has a June 2023 release date, have been closely watched.

The executive also revealed that while he is focused on theatrical releases, “a number of movies will be released with shorter windows … and with different marketing campaigns. But we’ll always be agile, and the focus will be on theatrical.”

Before the pandemic, theater owners could demand an exclusive theatrical window of 74 days to 90 days. Now, a film opening to $50 million or less domestically can be made available in the home as soon as two to three weeks after its theatrical release (Universal was the first major Hollywood studio to strike such terms.).

Zaslav’s comments come at a fraught time for DC. On Tuesday, Warners announced the news that it was shelving its $90 million Batgirl movie, which was deep into postproduction ahead of a planned HBO Max release. Multiple sources noted that Warner Media Discovery was opting to use losses from the film as a tax write-down rather than release it. The move has sparked jitters that other films could follow, with Blue Beetle filmmaker Angel Manuel Soto liking tweets asking Warners to protect his DC film, which was initially developed for HBO Max before being upgraded to theatrical.

Zaslav said that expensive films for streaming did not make economic sense.

“The objective is to grow the DC brand. To grow the DC characters. But also, our job is to protect the DC brand, and that’s what we’re going to do.”

Dave wrote:

The issue is creative decisions, not the size of the budgets or the box-office takings, which was the point originally being made.

I think the point was more about patience, maybe muddied by the box office figures, in reality it doesn’t matter how much they made, maybe more how much they spent.

DC accelerated everything after seeing the Avengers money and MCU plans (them copying Feige with a big chart of upcoming films), in truth the second film they made was a very high budget event with their 3 biggest characters  and when that and JL didn’t quite work have floundered without direction.

It’s true stuff like Wonder Woman and Aquaman have been big hits which to me strengthens the argument they should have done their solo films first.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Dave, Ben

The only thing on the DC radar that I am actually looking forward to is Peacemaker season 2. So long as that one doesn’t fall through the cracks of whatever is going on with HBO now, I’m good.

I would like to think that it is possible for them to put out another Wonder Woman movie that is on par with the first. I would also like to think that it is possible for them to make a Superman movie that isn’t a giant ball-ache. Not sure that I can at this point, though. Happy for them to prove me wrong.

2 users thanked author for this post.

Todd, Dave

6 users thanked author for this post.

Bruce, Uncle Retrospective, Ben, Todd, Dave

Step 1 – grant Disney a license to make a bunch of multiversal cross-over movies with the DC/Marvel characters

Step 2 – DO NOTHING ELSE

Step 3 – profit!

4 users thanked author for this post.

Ben, Todd, njerry

Dave wrote:

It’s not like it needs to take a decade to make an Avengers-level hit, it just needs some thought and careful planning put into it.

Dave wrote:

The issue – in simple terms – is making good films that people enjoy.

Dave wrote:

DC just didn’t make movies that people enjoyed as much as the MCU films. And that’s as much down to a thousand small creative decisions as any big sweeping differences in how the studios put the overarching franchise together.

Dave wrote:

The issue is creative decisions, not the size of the budgets or the box-office takings

WB needs to hire Dave Wallace. He gets it.

3 users thanked author for this post.

Chris-S, Dave

Finally I can make the $200m G’nort movie I’ve always dreamed of!

5 users thanked author for this post.

Bruce, njerry, Todd, garjones

Walter Hamada, who took over as head of DC Film after Justice League, wants to quite over the Batgirl cancellation: https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/dc-films-walter-hamada-exit-batgirl-1235193439/

He’ll apparently hang around until the release of Black Adam, but that’s probably it.

During his tenure, Hamada has forged relationships with filmmakers such as Marvel favorite James Gunn, bringing him on board for The Suicide Squad (2021) and keeping him in the fold for Peacemaker, a spinoff for HBO Max. Rather than strive for Marvel’s closely interconnected universe of films, DC’s properties under his watch were only loosely connected — and sometimes took place in entirely separate universes, such as Joker (2019), which overperformed with more than $1 billion at the box office and earned Joaquin Phoenix a best actor Oscar, and Matt Reeves’ The Batman (2022), which brought in $769.2 million globally, a strong figure for the pandemic.

1 user thanked author for this post.

Todd

4 users thanked author for this post.

lorcan_nagle, Todd, garjones

BTS photo from Batgirl:

Take with a grain of salt:

Gal Gadot’s Wonder Woman Returning In Multiple Upcoming DC Movies