The Politics Thread

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Talk politics here.

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Fwiw…

In one of the 2016 head to head debates, Hilary did say that Trump has a history of saying “No fair” whenever he loses a contest. She mentioned when the reality show “The Apprentice” featuring Trump lost the Emmy award a few seasons, each time he said the whole thing was fixed/rigged against him.

I am really surprised that this pattern of complaining is not emphasized to undermine his credibility.

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JRCarter

In order to lose credibility, Trump would have had to possess it in the first place.

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Al-x wrote:

Fwiw…

In one of the 2016 head to head debates, Hilary did say that Trump has a history of saying “No fair” whenever he loses a contest. She mentioned when the reality show “The Apprentice” featuring Trump lost the Emmy award a few seasons, each time he said the whole thing was fixed/rigged against him.

I am really surprised that this pattern of complaining is not emphasized to undermine his credibility.

I’m sure if the media explains why Trump is bad people will get it.

Yeah it’s somewhat naive. There’s a mountain of very obvious evidence that Trump is a liar, narcissistic and a hypocrite. It’s not hard to find. Trump is notoriously thin skinned and has a mountain of lawsuits over trivial things like Bill Maher calling him an orangutan. Maher also said correctly from day one he wouldn’t accept defeat in an election.

The 35% approval rating he got is basically people who don’t give a shit. Before the last election The Guardian US office spoke to people who switched from Obama to him and they didn’t hide they disliked a lot of what he did and his character was flawed. They liked that he wasn’t a politician, if the Democrats ran with Oprah or The Rock they’d win a landslide I think.

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I think a lot of people in the US don’t believe in any of the media at all. Nor should they honestly, it’s all garbage.

 

 

Anonymous wrote:

I think a lot of people in the US don’t believe in any of the media at all. Nor should they honestly, it’s all garbage.

On the contrary, I think too many people in the US choose to believe everything that FOX NEWS (or MSNBC, for that matter) tells them. Sadly, not enough Americans watch both channels equally to find a proper balance of mistruths — or, better yet, to just watch the news on the BBC or Al Jazeera channels instead to get something closer to the truth.

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Ironically, television news has always been the worst way to receive news. There are all sorts of inherent problems with the media and format. It is too quick, too short to be of any use or to even be accurate. There is not enough time to go into detail or do in-depth investigations and it focuses on sensational stories rather than giving a broad view of reality. It’s driven by a storyline that is decided very early and often proves untrue as more information comes in, but news producers stick with the storyline more than the truth.

Even Walter Conkrite would tell viewers to go read a newspaper after his news segments.

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Strangely it’s the other way around in the UK. Virtually all the newspapers have always been owned by moguls who push a personal agenda through the stories (The Guardian is an exception as it’s owned by a non profit trust). At the lower end they often blatantly just make shit up.

TV news and current affairs have always been under edicts to provide some level of balance and neutrality so you are more likely to get a more accurate version of events.

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lorcan_nagle, Todd

The most important thing is to not rely on any one news source. Every news source is biased because every human is biased. Read up on how various entities cover an event, keeping in mind their observed biases and you’ll come closer to the truth. Declaring that all news sources are bad is a really good way to fall for batshittery.

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Anonymous wrote:

Even Walter Conkrite would tell viewers to go read a newspaper after his news segments.

A bit ironic, since Cronkite anchored at a time when there were separate divisions within CBS Television for News and for Entertainment, and the two divisions rarely (if ever) crossed streams. Same was true for ABC and NBC. Somewhere along the way “News” was absorbed into the Entertainment division, and the focus gradually shifted from reporting the news without bias or “spin” to presenting the news sensationally and with an eye on ratings points. Cronkite was often cited as “the most trusted man in America”; can you think of a single news anchor today who could hold that title?

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njerry wrote:

can you think of a single news anchor today

Piers Morgan.

Oh sorry, you said “anchor”.

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Piers Morgan is… how can I say? … “reinventing” himself by bashing Megan Markle and making bold and brash remarks at other black celebrities and athletes in the news.

His walking out from that studio while on the air…

It worked to the point that he got himself a new gig at Fox News.

<p style=”text-align: left;”>

Al-x wrote:

Piers Morgan is… how can I say? … “reinventing” himself by bashing Megan Markle

Not sure it’s really a reinvention. He’s always been at least a bit of a twat.</p>

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njerry wrote:

Cronkite was often cited as “the most trusted man in America”; can you think of a single news anchor today who could hold that title?

I really don’t think so.

I think most of the anchors today do other things for their networks/channels that are more “news” than news. That kind of stuff diminishes trust. But of course, it makes them “relatable”. And really, isn’t that the most important thing in our current infotainment hellscape?

Martin Smith wrote:

Not sure it’s really a reinvention. He’s always been at least a bit of a twat.

He has.

I think Morgan confuses people at times because he doesn’t have a consistent political stance like most ranting opinion journalists do. He’s been anti Iraq war, campaigned for gun control in the US and pro tough Covid measures in the UK which we’d normally consider liberal stances. He’s also got a thick streak of gammon running through him with complaining about political correctness, women’s rights, minority rights and being a staunch royalist (which drives the Markle attacks).

In some ways it’s admirable he seems to have his own mind in a world where you increasingly have to take specific sides but the twat element is largely how he has gone about it. Americans may not know but he was fired as editor of the Daily Mirror because in his anti-war zeal he printed easily discredited fake photos of British soldiers abusing Iraqis. His stance on Markle has taken the form of ugly and obsessive relentless bullying.

Not unusual for the USA, when working there I would have CNN on in my hotel room and pretty much every single ad, all day, was for drugs and drug companies.

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Todd

garjones wrote:

Strangely it’s the other way around in the UK. Virtually all the newspapers have always been owned by moguls who push a personal agenda through the stories (The Guardian is an exception as it’s owned by a non profit trust). At the lower end they often blatantly just make shit up. TV news and current affairs have always been under edicts to provide some level of balance and neutrality so you are more likely to get a more accurate version of events.

That is an interesting difference that emerged from the BBC approach vs the FCC. In the US, obviously publishers like Hearst certainly used their power for specific goals promoting wars and influencing elections.

From this perspective, also newspapers and television news programs also promoted the Gulf War and the Wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. Every time it looked like we pulling out, news would ramp up about how bad it was over there. When Biden finally did pull the plug on Afghanistan, we practically had people over here throwing a tantrum and kicking and screaming on the studio floor over losing their war.

So, in that light, it is equally hypocritical that the news is calling out facebook and social media for their destructive policies. They might as well be saying “we can’t have Facebook, Twitter and Youtube out there lying to the people and sowing discord… that’s our job!”

I mean, most of the content the platforms were putting in front of users came from various news sources. Facebook wasn’t out there directly writing the stories or making the videos. The divisive messages were part of the agendas for outlets like CNN, Fox, MSNBC, etc.

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Todd

A QAnon influencer who accused Democrats of being pedophiles turned out to be a convicted child molester

https://www.insider.com/qanon-influencer-said-dems-were-pedophiles-is-real-child-molester-2021-10?utm_source=copy-link&utm_medium=referral&utm_content=topbar

It always seems to be the one pointing the finger.

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Weirdly Epstein was anything the Qanon people said was happening, but Epstein doesn’t seem to be big in their theories.

Yeah well Qanon has always clearly had a political agenda but delivered via conspiracy theories.

It reminds me a bit of Tommy Robinson in his campaign against grooming gangs in the UK, which on face value seems a noble cause but Tommy only ever highlights the ones where the perpetrators are Asian, which is statistically a minority of cases. So it’s not a big question to ask is he genuinely concerned for the victims or really a racist angle (considering his background in far right groups it’s not hard to work out).

They don’t give a toss about protecting kids they care about demonising Democrats and Epstein is not helpful in that regard.

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There were some key losses by the Dem party Tuesday. It doesn’t look good, especially heading into next year with the Midterms next November.

The GOP have been scaring whites to vote with racist fearmongering for years. Remember George Bush Senior with the Willie Horton ad that scared a lot of voters from Dukakis?

Now it is this Critical Race Theory and the hysteria that is built up over it. For the record, it is still just a course taught in various law schools in the first year, NOT k-12…

OK…. Please finish this sentence with your own ideas if you want. Preferably, be serious:

If the Dems were smart, they would…

Al-x wrote:

If the Dems were smart, they would…

..turn the leadership over to the progressives like AOC to inject new blood and new life into what has become a geriatric and lifeless party. I mean, we have 78-year-old Joe Biden in the White House, 81-year-old Nancy Pelosi as leader of the House, and 70-year-old Chuck Schumer in charge of the Senate. What if some crisis occurs while they’re all taking an afternoon nap?!

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Todd, lorcan_nagle, JRCarter

True.

I am concerned beyond the midterms as to who will be the nominee in 2024. No one younger has been groomed. Still I don’t know if the public wants to hear about socialism as they think it is. It has never been properly defined to the public. As for AOC, she is not a revolutionary but works within the US structure.

You know, if a certain GOP populist regains power as POTUS…That might be it unless the military does a coup and take over down the road.

Strange…. I mean in school we were always taught about the Constitution, the government structure with checks and balances to ensure one section of the government doesn’t get out of hand.

I have to say that there has been a HUGE work around to that as shown by you-know-who and his people.

Rules don’t count unless they’re enforced.

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Apropos of this discussion:

What Democrats Need to Realize Before 2022

If all the news media know there’s a problem with the Democratic Party, and the political analysts know there’s a problem with the Democratic Party, and the average citizen with half a brain knows there’s a problem with the Democratic Party… then why doesn’t the leadership of the Democratic Party seem to understand that there’s a problem, and why aren’t they doing anything and everything to fix it? Why haven’t they taken Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema into a back room somewhere and figured out how to get them to line up with the rest of the Party, the same way the GOP has voted in lockstep since the days of the Tea Party?

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njerry wrote:

If all the news media know there’s a problem with the Democratic Party, and the political analysts know there’s a problem with the Democratic Party, and the average citizen with half a brain knows there’s a problem with the Democratic Party… then why doesn’t the leadership of the Democratic Party seem to understand that there’s a problem, and why aren’t they doing anything and everything to fix it? Why haven’t they taken Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema into a back room somewhere and figured out how to get them to line up with the rest of the Party, the same way the GOP has voted in lockstep since the days of the Tea Party?

They’re protecting their class interests. The problem is that their class interests don’t align as well with the Democrat voter base as the Republican ones do with theirs. As a result Manchin and Sinema are essentially designated bad guys so the Dems can wring their hands and say “we wanted to provide all the things we promised, but we need to keep those two over there on-side and that’s why we’re gutting this social welfare bill”. And mark my words, if the Dems had 51 seats in the Senate, there’d be three rebel Senators.

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In a simple sense, the Democratic party is not the party on the side of economically vulnerable people any more than the Republican party is. People that are poor and people who have to work to make a living are not being served by either party in any real sense.

 

 

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Latest UK political news:

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lorcan_nagle wrote:

They’re protecting their class interests. The problem is that their class interests don’t align as well with the Democrat voter base as the Republican ones do with theirs. As a result Manchin and Sinema are essentially designated bad guys so the Dems can wring their hands and say “we wanted to provide all the things we promised, but we need to keep those two over there on-side and that’s why we’re gutting this social welfare bill”. And mark my words, if the Dems had 51 seats in the Senate, there’d be three rebel Senators.

During the first two years of his presidency, Barack Obama made the mistake of trying to compromise with the other side of the aisle and try to reach a Democratic/Republican consensus, but the GOP refused to deal with his team, which pleased no one and led to the Dems losing control of the House and Senate in the midterm elections. Biden learned from Obama’s mistakes and in the earliest days of his presidency he passed bills without any Republican support; but now he can’t even do that due to dissenters within his own Party.

Frustrating.

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My advice Jerry is just to follow the UK example, walk up to Joe Manchin and call him a cunt. I can’t guarantee it will get any bills passed but it will at least be funny.

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garjones wrote:

My advice Jerry is just to follow the UK example, walk up to Joe Manchin and call him a cunt. I can’t guarantee it will get any bills passed but it will at least be funny.

Sinema’s constituents have been chasing her through airports and other public spaces because she’s stopped doing Town Hall meetings and her office basically ignores them.

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Rocket, Todd

lorcan_nagle wrote:

garjones wrote:

My advice Jerry is just to follow the UK example, walk up to Joe Manchin and call him a cunt. I can’t guarantee it will get any bills passed but it will at least be funny.

Sinema’s constituents have been chasing her through airports and other public spaces because she’s stopped doing Town Hall meetings and her office basically ignores them.

Sounds like someone wants to get primaried…

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lorcan_nagle

njerry wrote:

lorcan_nagle wrote:

They’re protecting their class interests. The problem is that their class interests don’t align as well with the Democrat voter base as the Republican ones do with theirs. As a result Manchin and Sinema are essentially designated bad guys so the Dems can wring their hands and say “we wanted to provide all the things we promised, but we need to keep those two over there on-side and that’s why we’re gutting this social welfare bill”. And mark my words, if the Dems had 51 seats in the Senate, there’d be three rebel Senators.

During the first two years of his presidency, Barack Obama made the mistake of trying to compromise with the other side of the aisle and try to reach a Democratic/Republican consensus, but the GOP refused to deal with his team, which pleased no one and led to the Dems losing control of the House and Senate in the midterm elections. Biden learned from Obama’s mistakes and in the earliest days of his presidency he passed bills without any Republican support; but now he can’t even do that due to dissenters within his own Party.

Frustrating.

And Biden is basically getting all the blame for the GOP, Manchin and Sinema refusing to work with the other 48 Dems. I’m some big Biden fan, but the sometimes media seems to love to paint it like if he just tried harder then he could pass his whole agenda. And with so much focus on Manchin and Sinema, the 50 GOP senators basically get a free pass for their obstruction.

I still can’t believe our only two choices are a group of racist, sexist assholes or a group of naive, equally compromised ineffectuals who keep letting the racist assholes walk all over them.

 

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Chris D wrote:

the 50 GOP senators basically get a free pass for their obstruction.

A very important but overlooked fact. If only two of the 50 GOP senators broke rank and voted yes, we wouldn’t need Manchin and Sinema. Maybe more effort should be expended on getting Susan Collins and Lisa Murkowsky to vote their consciences instead of their re-election funding

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Chris D wrote:

I still can’t believe our only two choices are a group of racist, sexist assholes or a group of naive, equally compromised ineffectuals who keep letting the racist assholes walk all over them.

Still that’s fairly representative of the US population so… democracy at work, I suppose.

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Happy Four Seasons Total Landscaping Day everyone!

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Has it been a year already?

Anonymous wrote:

Chris D wrote:

I still can’t believe our only two choices are a group of racist, sexist assholes or a group of naive, equally compromised ineffectuals who keep letting the racist assholes walk all over them.

Still that’s fairly representative of the US population so… democracy at work, I suppose.

A solid point, for sure. Although due to gerrymandering and the way the Senate was built, I’d say the racist, sexist assholes portion of America is at least a bit over represented.

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lorcan_nagle

Sen. Ted Cruz Trolls Big Bird After Sesame Street Covid-19 Vaccine Tweet

Anonymous wrote:

BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP BEEP

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“Self discipline and hard-working and extremely tight government control over the release of actual facts regarding the rampant spread of COVID 19 within our borders are keys to why China can claim that they can defeat rounds of COVID 19 outbreak.”

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Jan. 6 panel subpoenas 6 more Trump associates in probe

WASHINGTON (AP) — Further expanding its probe, the U.S. House committee investigating the Jan. 6 Capitol insurrection has issued subpoenas to six additional associates of former President Donald Trump who were closely involved in his efforts to overturn his defeat in the 2020 election.

The committee’s chairman, Mississippi Rep. Bennie Thompson, said in a statement Monday that the panel is demanding testimony and documents from former Trump campaign officials and others who participated in a “war room” ahead of the siege and strategized about how to halt the certification of Joe Biden’s victory.

Thompson said the committee had issued new subpoenas to Bill Stepien, manager of Trump’s 2020 reelection campaign; Jason Miller, a senior adviser to the campaign; Angela McCallum, national executive assistant to the campaign; John Eastman, a lawyer who advised the former president; Michael Flynn, a former national security adviser to Trump who talked with Trump ahead of the insurrection; and Bernard Kerik, who the committee says paid for hotel rooms that served as command centers ahead of Jan. 6.

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JRCarter wrote:

and Bernard Kerik, who the committee says paid for hotel rooms that served as command centers ahead of Jan. 6.

It’s worth noting that Bernard Kerik was appointed Police Commissioner of NYC back when Rudy Guiliani was Mayor; later had multiple convictions for (among other things) tax fraud and making criminal false statements; and received a presidential pardon from Donald Trump in 2020 before he left office. He reeks of scumbag-ism.

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It has been reported that Marjorie Taylor Green posted on social media the GOP members who voted for the infrastructure bill and now those members are getting death threats, branded traitors… Green has openly followed and harassed AOC, GOP member Yoho called AOC a f*cking b*tch, posters of Green carrying a firearm pointed at Dem members, the anime posted a few days ago, now former Trump advisors have been subponead and Bannon just brushes it off…

Then the people who actually voted Green, Boebert, Gaetz, etc. to power…

People have always been this way but now they are open about it and more brazen.

What is it? A brainwashing?…

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Todd

Al-x wrote:

People have always been this way but now they are open about it and more brazen.
What is it? A brainwashing?…

You’re right, some politicians have been narrowminded and sexist and racist and homophobic and xenophobic and elitist all along, but until Donald Trump ran for president most people understood that their secret feelings could hurt their chances for re-election against a more all-encompassing candidate. They thought they needed the minority vote from Blacks, Latinos, LGBTQ and other groups and therefore could not risk exposing their true beliefs and feelings.

When Trump campaigned on a platform of hate and intolerance, and won the presidency in spite of that, these other politicians realized that maybe they don’t need to cater to those minorities in order to win their elections. And just to make sure, they changed the voting rules to make it harder for certain groups to actually cast a vote.

And it’s not just the politicians; a large segment of America (larger than I realized) have felt the same way too, and have been empowered during the Trump presidency to reveal their true feelings towards other segments of society who don’t look like them or behave like them.

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Judge Rejects Trump’s Bid to Keep Papers Secret in Jan. 6 Inquiry

Trump probably wishes Twitter hadn’t banned him so he could post a mean tweet about the judge.

So true @njerry

The infrastructure bill as well as other Dem proposals offer more for the working man than the GOP. Yet many white GOP still are against it even when it is as clear as day that they will also benefit. Why? Partly because they have been conditioned to be anti Dem no matter what and want to make the Dem (especially the Dem POTUS) look bad. Also (and this is something I heard from sociology about their overall attitude) that because it will also help minority people of color, they will spite themselves to stop minorities from getting ahead.

Interesting how they insist on “American exceptionalism” ie, America is #1 in everything even though key social and economic statistics that measure the prosperity and standard of living of industrialized countries don’t have the US anywhere near the top.
Also, they talk about freedom of election, but when their side loses, then Jan 6th… Also, the past segregation/apartheid society that some said was “great”, wasn’t at all free or egalitarian.

It is like some veil of contradiction and ignorance is over them.

Texas governor orders criminal probe into ‘pornography’ in school books

Can’t help but make comparisons to book burning.

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Todd

.@Peston: Is Trump coming back?@AmbJohnBolton: I will make a firm prediction for you… he will not run in 2024.

Former US National Security Advisor @AmbJohnBolton predicts Donald Trump won’t run for President again because he fears being called a “loser”.#Peston pic.twitter.com/twUG059b38

— Peston (@itvpeston) November 10, 2021

[Chris D]

Al-x wrote:

It has been reported that Marjorie Taylor Green posted on social media the GOP members who voted for the infrastructure bill and now those members are getting death threats, branded traitors… Green has openly followed and harassed AOC, GOP member Yoho called AOC a f*cking b*tch, posters of Green carrying a firearm pointed at Dem members, the anime posted a few days ago, now former Trump advisors have been subponead and Bannon just brushes it off…

Then the people who actually voted Green, Boebert, Gaetz, etc. to power…

People have always been this way but now they are open about it and more brazen.

What is it? A brainwashing?…

It’s the lack of consequences and accountability. People like Gaetz, Green, Gosar and Bannon are just following the example set by Trump. Do whatever you want because the system is rigged in favor of them. The system has always been rigged in favor of white people and wealthy people. And our political system is also rigged in favor of conservatives. If they all band together and refuse to hold each other accountable then they can get away with anything. In my mind, it’s sadly only a matter of time before major political figures start getting assassinated. The right wing, in conjunction with Fox News, have been priming America in that direction for decades. It’s honestly shocking nothing that terrible has really happened yet. Although Jan 6 showed that it can happen. Couple with the right’s attempt to whitewash that day and it’s really only a matter of when, not if, it’ll happen again with much more dire results.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by Chris D.

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Trump again:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump-defends-jan-6-rioters-hang-mike-pence-chant-in-newly-released-audio/ar-AAQD6gs?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531

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Todd

I had @_whitneywebb on early in the pandemic and she said it would be used to restructure the entire economy where regular people would be told to make do with less while billionaires make insane profits. So far she’s been completely right. https://t.co/zWGP519eHy

— Tim Dillon (@TimJDillon) November 13, 2021

Mike Pence ‘Ashamed’ of Trump, Might Poach His Voters in 2024 Election: Ex-Press Secretary

https://www.newsweek.com/mike-pence-ashamed-trump-might-poach-his-voters-2024-election-ex-press-sec-1649102

Oh, now he’s ashamed of Trump?

Also, wasn’t the general consensus that a Pence Presidency would be worse?

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Todd

@todd, we’re counting on you to make this happen!
Beto to run for governor of Texas

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JRCarter wrote:

Mike Pence ‘Ashamed’ of Trump, Might Poach His Voters in 2024 Election: Ex-Press Secretary

https://www.newsweek.com/mike-pence-ashamed-trump-might-poach-his-voters-2024-election-ex-press-sec-1649102

Oh, now he’s ashamed of Trump?

Also, wasn’t the general consensus that a Pence Presidency would be worse?

That’s some hardcore wishful thinking from Pence’s old employee. Trumpers hate Pence, Liberals hate Pence and the anti Trump Republicans probably view him as incredibly weak for not standing up to Trump after Jan 6. So I’ve no clue which voters they think he could actually poach. Pence is a spineless loser.

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Chris D wrote:

it’s sadly only a matter of time before major political figures start getting assassinated.

… and I wouldn’t be surprised. Pence knows (and always knew) what that mob would have done to him had they found him Jan 6.

As I said before, in school we learned about the Constitution, branches of government, the checks and balances that supposedly would prevent a branch of government from getting out of hand.

Well, as we see, there is (and has been) a big work around.

The US could easily become a dictatorship in a few years and it is already in the works right now.

Al-x wrote:

The US could easily become a dictatorship in a few years and it is already in the works right now.

Don’t worry; Kyle Rittenhouse will protect us!

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Todd

njerry wrote:

@todd, we’re counting on you to make this happen!
Beto to run for governor of Texas

I’ll do what I can but you’re not giving me much to work with.

Speaking of anti-Trump Republicans:

Wyoming GOP votes to stop recognizing Cheney as a Republican

If Biden Retires in 2024, Kamala Harris Will Be the Democratic Nominee

She’s got about two years to get her approval rating up.

Todd wrote:

I’ll do what I can but you’re not giving me much to work with.

When you vote, you are exercising political authority, you’re using force. And force, my friends, is violence. The supreme authority from which all other authorities are derived. Buy an AR-15.

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Todd

njerry wrote:

Al-x wrote:

The US could easily become a dictatorship in a few years and it is already in the works right now.

Don’t worry; Kyle Rittenhouse will protect us!

To be honest, I wasn’t joking and that is the scary part.

If you look up thread on the previous page, I posted the video segment by Bill Maher “The slow moving coup”. Basically, he stated how the voter suppression laws are already being done to help rig a GOP sweep in next year’s midterms and with that done, it will be easier for you know who to run and seize power again in 2024.

It stands to reason that the federal voter bill must be done. It might help.

It’s been said that Putin initially ran about returning Russia to some former glory, then once in, slowly was about changing the voting system to his favor, some key critics of him mysteriously losing their lives, and now he can’t really be driven out.

Guess who is a fan of him?

As I said, I wasn’t joking.

Here:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/former-white-house-russia-advisor-says-trump-envies-putin-because-he-wants-to-rule-as-he-pleases/ar-AAQLziJ?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531

In this YouTube, pick up the recording of Trump’s words at 2:26

No, Donald Trump Will Not Be Reinstated as President

Perhaps not reinstated, but, unfortunately, no guarantee that he won’t be re-elected. Never underestimate the stupidity of the American voter.

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Todd

JRCarter wrote:

Never underestimate the stupidity of the American voter.

And never underestimate the ability of the Democratic Party to get in its own way, and the desperation of the Republican Party to do whatever it takes to win.

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[Al-x]

Surprisingly that St. Louis couple who were pictured last year with guns supposedly defending their house when the BLM passed by. They showed up at the Rittenhouse trial.

Future GOP ticket:

Rittenhouse and that punk kid who was pictured with the smirk on his face to the Native American

As for the stupidity of some voters, check out some YouTube videos of The Daily Show, where have a field reporter covering the Trump rallies and asking questions there.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=daily+show+klepper+

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by Al-x.
• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by Al-x.
• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by Al-x.

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Todd

This is happening too. I still doubt there will be significant jail time. But who knows.

 

Jury selection begins in Ghislaine Maxwell’s sex-trafficking trial : NPR

 

 

Chris D wrote:

In my mind, it’s sadly only a matter of time before major political figures start getting assassinated.

I think it is also a danger here in Europe. The political climate is boiling over here, and security for political leaders in the Netherlands had to be increased after multiple threats. We have one political party in particular that is fanning the flames of extremism, even belittling the holocaust recently. Anti-semitism in the Netherlands is quite rare and they only got about 5 % in the recent elections, but their supporters can be quite unhinged.

 

As much as I disagree with a lot of things going on right now, I don’t believe in a violent solution.

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garjones

Anonymous wrote:

I think it is also a danger here in Europe.

Two British MPs have been assassinated in the last 5 years. One murderer from the far right, one an Islamic fundamentalist, both terrorists in my view.

There are only 650 MPs so that probably gives a higher mortality rate than police or armed forces.

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Todd

Anonymous wrote:

his is happening too. I still doubt there will be significant jail time. But who knows.

I suspect it’s all or nothing Arjan, the charges are serious so she either gets off or gets a long term.

Her father was a crook too but most likely killed himself before he had to face the music (Robert Maxwell swindled millions from a pension fund and ‘fell overboard’ from his yacht, body never found).

It’s thought that fall from grace and drop in her circumstances took her into Epstein’s circle, raised a billionaire’s daughter Epstein could provide her a continuation of the lifestyle after the family fortune was gone.

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Todd

Here’s some good news:

Self-styled ‘QAnon shaman’ is sentenced to 41 months in Capitol riot

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Todd, njerry

garjones wrote:

One murderer from the far right, one an Islamic fundamentalist, both terrorists in my view.

Oh yes I forgot about the MP that got stabbed to death recently.

 

In the Netherlands Geert Wilders is constantly threatened by Muslims, he has 24/7 security and has to live in a secret location. Wilders is an asshole and Islamophobe but death threats are unacceptable. Even though I have to admit he is a threat for Dutch Muslims, for their religious freedom anyway. If he had his way he would close all mosques and outlaw the Quran.

 

The last time a politician got murdered here it was a right wing politician who was murdered by a left winger, but the threats are coming from both sides.

They are, and the most important thing we need to grasp to is not to play this ‘both sides’ bullshit. Acts are hateful and illegal regardless of what news channel you watch.

 

 

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garjones wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

his is happening too. I still doubt there will be significant jail time. But who knows.

I suspect it’s all or nothing Arjan, the charges are serious so she either gets off or gets a long term.

Her father was a crook too but most likely killed himself before he had to face the music (Robert Maxwell swindled millions from a pension fund and ‘fell overboard’ from his yacht, body never found).

It’s thought that fall from grace and drop in her circumstances took her into Epstein’s circle, raised a billionaire’s daughter Epstein could provide her a continuation of the lifestyle after the family fortune was gone.

I wonder if the names of prince Andrew, Trump or Clinton will even be mentioned during the trial. They are probably completely ignoring the whole blackmail angle and intelligence angle that was speculated on and confirmed to some extent.

 

Jeffrey Epstein: why his case inspires so many conspiracy theories – Vox

I think a lot will depend on what’s realistically going to hold up in court. A lot of it is feasible (the Clinton/Trump ordered his murder though is probably too far into conspiracy) but whether there’s substantial enough evidence is the key. They’d need some documentation to back a blackmail charge up.

They may have more evidence tucked away but if they don’t I can’t see that going anywhere.

In further “Trump is a child” news:

Trump Actively Seeking Vengeful Ouster of Alabama’s Republican Governor, Report Says

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Todd

@LORCAN_NAGLE, here’s your new hobby:

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Commentary on Democrats and race:

Are Democrats the “real racists”? Well, they used to be: Here’s the history

Could it be that you’re a level of crazy that puts off even the most strident Republicans? Nawww…

Mike Lindell Blames a Vast GOP Conspiracy for His Supreme Court Failure

MyPillow chief and 2020 dead-ender Mike Lindell has long promised that he would file an election-fraud complaint with the Supreme Court on Tuesday morning. But now he claims to have missed that goal because he was silenced by Republican National Committee Chairperson Ronna McDaniel.

It was a last-minute pressure campaign orchestrated by the RNC and McDaniel that prevented his case from moving forward and “saving the country,” Lindell now alleges.

“We believe that they have reached out to multiple [attorneys general] and put pressure on them, not to sign the Supreme Court complaint,” Lindell said Monday on his evening livestream, this time from aboard his private plane as he scrambled to lock down the signatures required to file his complaint with the high court.

With a poor WiFi connection marring his live-streamed rant, Lindell blasted McDaniel, alleging she orchestrated a vast Republican conspiracy against him when she finally acknowledged late last week that President Joe Biden won the 2020 election.

“How dare the RNC try and stop this case from getting to the Supreme Court. Shame on you, RNC! You are worse than Fox [News] now!” he stated, referencing his claims that the cable giant has silenced him. “You can’t tell me why Ronna McDaniel, the head of the RNC, made a statement saying Biden won three days before this Supreme Court complaint was supposed to go to the Supreme Court.”

“What about the timing of that, America!” he continued. “Why would she say that at that moment in time? She didn’t have to say that. What, is she trying to get more donor money? Is she trying to get donor money from Democrats? She is as RINO as they come!” McDaniel did not immediately respond to The Daily Beast’s request for comment.

The MAGA loyalist further admitted that numerous Republican attorneys general had called him to seek a time extension on his Tuesday deadline before they signed their names to his filing. “Can we get more time?” Lindell claimed such GOP officials told him in recent days.

Clearly irate and yelling over the roar of his plane’s engines, Lindell argued that if the predominantly Republican state attorneys general ultimately refuse to sign onto his Supreme Court filing, the pillow baron—never one to back down from a delusional pursuit—has a backup plan.

“We do have a copy of the complaint,” which Lindell said he would simply release to the public on Thanksgiving Day if it ends up not being filed due to a lack of signatures. “Worst-case scenario, let’s say, a lot of them want to delay signing it,” he added, under the impression his fervent supporters would then mount local pressure campaigns against their own state attorneys general after seeing the contents of his filing.

Additionally, the pillow tycoon claimed late Monday that he was making a last-minute sprint across five states in the dead of night to convince attorneys general to sign his papers. “I am on my way to another city,” he asserted, adding that if they don’t sign by Tuesday he can always try to get them to sign by Wednesday.

“Worst-case scenario because what is going on out there with the RNC,” he said. “Shame on them. How dare they!”

Since former President Donald Trump decidedly lost the 2020 election, the MyPillow CEO has been on an unending crusade based on lies about widespread voter fraud. Lindell has continually promised that after his investigations prove his conspiracy theory, the election would be overturned and Trump would be reinstated. But his self-imposed deadlines have repeatedly come and gone, including a deadline for Trump to be reinstated by early August.

Along the way, Lindell has fought plenty of battles against unlikely opponents, including right-wing behemoths like Newsmax and Fox News, as well as invisible foes like “antifa” insurgents at his unhinged “cyber symposium” this past summer.

Lindell concluded his Monday evening live stream by promoting his 96-hour virtual “Thanks-a-Thon” event set to kick off Wednesday night at midnight and feature four straight days of even more election conspiracies.

But as of Tuesday morning, the Supreme Court had no record of any filing from the state attorneys general or Lindell.

And reached for comment by The Daily Beast about his non-existent Supreme Court filing and why it hasn’t been made public, the pillow mogul fumed.

“Are you out of your mind?” Lindell shouted. “You call me again, I am suing you!”

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Interesting that there’s only one who studied politics. And law is overrepresented.

Anonymous wrote:

Interesting that there’s only one who studied politics. And law is overrepresented.

If it helps, the current Taoiseach has an MA in Political History, but worked as a teacher before entering politics.

Ah I see the map is old…well for the Netherlands it’s still the same dude.

Anonymous wrote:

And law is overrepresented.

Being a lawyer teaches you how best to bullshit, uh.. Persuade people.

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Todd

I thought Johnson had a degree in classics or somesuch nonsense.

Martin Smith wrote:

I thought Johnson had a degree in classics or somesuch nonsense.

The graphic was made in 2017, so that was what, 8 Prime Ministers ago?

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Todd

lorcan_nagle wrote:

Martin Smith wrote:

I thought Johnson had a degree in classics or somesuch nonsense.

The graphic was made in 2017, so that was what, 8 Prime Ministers ago?

Oh yeah. I was looking at it on my phone and the date was too small to see. Yeah, 2017 would have been… Theresa May? Does that sound right? Was she ever Prime Minister? It doesn’t feel like she was.

Could have been Jim Jaspers. He was either PM for 6 years or two months, can never tell which.

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The crazy thing in the UK is there is an unofficial training path to high office, which is the PPE (philosophy, politics and economics) course at Oxford or Cambridge. Many cabinet members and David Cameron trod that path. Then again the whole system in the UK is enormously rigged:

“Power rests with a narrow section of the population—the 7% who attend private schools and the 1% who graduate from Oxford and Cambridge.” These are the findings of a report by the Sutton Trust and Social Mobility Commission.

Elitist Britain, based on a survey of 5,000 individuals, details the stranglehold on the commanding heights of British society maintained by a tiny ruling elite. According to the study, these “influential people” are overall five times more likely to be privately educated than the average population.

When those educated in selective state grammar schools—overwhelmingly dominated by the upper classes—are included, the disparity grows even wider. The elite are also eight times more likely to have attended a top Russell Group University and twenty-four times more likely to have gone to Oxbridge (Oxford or Cambridge) Universities.

Just 7 percent of the population as a whole attend private schools, while only 5 percent attend grammar schools. Only 19 percent of the current working population has attended any university, 6 percent have gone to a Russell Group University and less than one percent to either Oxford or Cambridge.

By contrast, in politics and the judiciary, the private and grammar school educated account for 46 percent of Members of Parliament, 79 percent of the House of Lords, 73 percent of civil service Permanent Secretaries, 73 percent of public body chairs, 43 percent of select committee chairs and a massive 85 percent of senior judges.

Twenty-four percent of MPs went to Oxbridge, as did 38 percent of Lords, 56 percent of Permanent Secretaries, 40 percent of public body chairs, 33 percent of select committee chairs and 71 percent of senior judges. Well over half of all these groups went to Russell Group universities.

It is the same story in the army and the police, where 64 percent of senior members of the armed forces and 45 percent of police chiefs are from private or grammar schools. Sixteen percent of senior armed forces officers and 13 percent of police chiefs went to Oxbridge.

And if anyone wishes to know why this system of grotesque, all-encompassing class privilege is so rarely criticized by the media, 68 percent of newspaper columnists went to a private or grammar school, 63 percent of the most influential news media figures and 49 percent of BBC executives. Forty-four percent of newspaper columnists have Oxbridge backgrounds, as do 36 percent of the most influential media figures and 31 percent of BBC executives. Over 70 percent of all these groups attended at least a Russell Group University.

To complete the cultural picture of privilege, 25 percent of pop stars and 56 percent of the richest figures in TV, Film and Music went to a private or grammar school. In sport, 43 percent of men and 35 percent of women playing international cricket for England went to private school, as well as 37 percent of male British rugby union internationals and an extraordinary one in three Olympic medallists.

The only one that’s slightly skewed there is in sport. A lot of people from ordinary backgrounds get scholarships to private school 6th form because the schools  want to win trophies, there was one in my class in school who was Wales under 16s rugby captain so got offered a free place. Ellis Genge is in those figures who comes from a single parent family in a rough council estate in Bristol but got offered a place at Hartbury College aged 16 just because he was good at rugby. I believe that aspect is very similar in the US too, come from a shit background but are seven foot one and can dunk a basketball and we’ll find a place.

 

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Poll: Harris, Michelle Obama lead for 2024 if Biden doesn’t run

Vice President Kamala Harris and former First Lady Michelle Obama are in the lead for a 2024 presidential run if President Biden decides not to try for a second term, a new Hill-HarrisX poll found.

The poll found Harris in the lead among likely candidates, with 13 percent of respondents supporting her. Michelle Obama came in second at 10 percent.

All other candidates listed received 5 percent or less support, with most voters surveyed still unsure of who they would back if Biden chose not run.

Other candidates in the poll included 2020 presidential hopefuls Bernie Sanders, Elizabeth Warren, Cory Booker, Michael Bloomberg, Andrew Yang and Pete Buttigieg.

Thirty-six percent said they were “unsure” who they would vote for, while 13 percent said they would choose someone who was not on the list.

Biden has said before that he intends to run in 2024. If he won, he would be 81 years old at the start of his second term.

Among poll respondents who voted for Biden in 2020, 22 percent said they would vote for Harris, the most out of any candidate in the poll.

Harris has struggled with her approval ratings since the start of her tenure as vice president. She has been tasked under Biden with handling the southern border and voting rights.

The poll surveyed 939 registered voters from Nov. 18 to Nov. 19. The margin or error is plus or minus 3.2 percentage points.

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Todd

[Al-x]

The Dems are in trouble…

Biden is at best a band aid. He is getting up there and for all we know, might not make it to 2024.

Should have been grooming a young up and coming candidate a LONG TIME AGO.

Now, it may be too late.

Beto Orourke? Buttigieg?

Comments?

I get the feeling the US will be a white supremacist dictatorship in the next few years.

• This reply was modified 3 years, 5 months ago by Al-x.

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Todd

For the record, there was a panel developed to handle virus pandemics since George Bush Jr. and it was continued by Obama.

Guess what happened to it when you know who took office…

https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/511320-pandemic-preparedness-and-response-under-a-different-president

A pandemic plan was in place. Trump abandoned it — and science — in the face of Covid-19

https://www.google.com/search?q=US+pandemic+panel&biw=1920&bih=929&sxsrf=AOaemvLyffdMkb8qXxanMKBvMlDDQFpivg%3A1637961864747&ei=iFChYfaHLY2VwbkPgrSM8AE&ved=0ahUKEwj26-m4-7b0AhWNSjABHQIaAx4Q4dUDCA4&#038;

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Todd

More people died from covid under Biden than under Trump.

 

It’s a tough situation, you can have some restrictions for some time, but you can’t keep people in quarantine forever, stop kids from going to school, discriminate on medical grounds etc.

 

I do not like the violent riots over covid restrictions, and some of the more extreme rhetoric, but I do think it’s a balancing act, and I believe we are leaning too heavily into an authoritarian direction.

Anonymous wrote:

More people died from covid under Biden than under Trump.

Are you sure about that?

https://khn.org/news/nation-records-400000-covid-deaths-on-last-day-of-donald-trump-presidency/

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/u-s-has-already-seen-more-covid-deaths-in-2021-than-2020-before-vaccines-were-available-as-experts-again-warn-pandemic-is-not-over-11637769586

I don’t want a 3 page tangent but please consider: how many during Biden were really a carryover from the previous?
How Trump handled the virus from the very beginning… If he had been more serious and told everyone to get vaccinated, things would be very different now and the GOP even know it.

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Todd

Anonymous wrote:

More people died from covid under Biden than under Trump.

 

It’s a tough situation, you can have some restrictions for some time, but you can’t keep people in quarantine forever, stop kids from going to school, discriminate on medical grounds etc.

 

I do not like the violent riots over covid restrictions, and some of the more extreme rhetoric, but I do think it’s a balancing act, and I believe we are leaning too heavily into an authoritarian direction.

Simply saying more people have died under Biden than Trump misses a lot. First, under Trump most states had had heavy restrictions and mandates, most travel was shut down, etc. It also doesn’t take into account the huge winter surge at the beginning of the year, I.e, the people already infected, hospitalized and/or near death when Biden took office. Deaths in the US were around 3000 a day as Trump left office and continued like that for serval weeks after Biden was sworn in. Hospitalization and death are lagging indicators. Then, of course, there’s the fact the the overwhelming majority still dying are unvaccinated, and the overwhelming majority of unvaccinated are conservatives. And the anti-mask, anti-vax, anti-science rhetoric floating through that crowd is a direct result of Trump and his allies downplaying, making fun of and downright attacking these things.

Yes, it’s a tough situation, but Trump made it worse at every possible step in just about everyway.

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Al-x wrote:

Are you sure about that?

I thought I was, I checked but I was wrong. It was up to 430,000 on January 20th and 800,000 now so more died under Trump but not by a huge margin.

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