Out now, one episode a week for six weeks.
Ms. Marvel on Disney+ (SPOILERS!)
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That was a lot of fun! Almost disappointed when we got to the “she gets powers” stuff, as I was enjoying so much as a show about being a teenage Avengers fangirl in the MCU.
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I liked that a lot. Really well directed and I loved all the effects of animating the graffiti and showing the text messages in the environment.
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My son loved this, enough to want to watch the episode a second time on the day of release.
I thought it was fine – it was pretty much what I expected in terms of it being pitched young, but the character is brought to life well (the actor is likeable and the performance is fine) and some of the visual flourishes help to give it a feel of its own.
It’s not massively exciting for me personally (it feels geared towards teens and younger, not adults really) but it’s not bad either, and at this point it’s not like I’m dreading having to sit through future episodes.
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I thought the first episode of Ms Marvel was great. The dialogue was zippy and funny, they’ve deviated the origin for obvious reasons (don’t talk about Inhumans) but other than that it is very true to the original material which is one of the best new comics of recent years. All the personal relationships and characters are spot-on.
We’ll see how it develops but that’s the best opening episode Disney+ have made with Marvel material.
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I absolutely hated this… it was dumb and cringy and everything felt fake… I wasn’t planning on watching this show, but decided to give the first episode a go just in case, and nope, it’s everything I thought it’d be: not for me… I actually almost truned it off with the begining montage, I really should have.
Also, sorry but why are people cosplaying as Gamora? Why are they selling merchandise with phrases like “I can do this all day”? How the fuck would people know about all of that shit? Have they been also watching the movies? I can’t decide if it’s stupid or lazy… anyhoo… nope nope nope.
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I absolutely hated this… it was dumb and cringy and everything felt fake… I wasn’t planning on watching this show, but decided to give the first episode a go just in case, and nope, it’s everything I thought it’d be: not for me… I actually almost truned it off with the begining montage, I really should have.
Also, sorry but why are people cosplaying as Gamora? Why are they selling merchandise with phrases like “I can do this all day”? How the fuck would people know about all of that shit? Have they been also watching the movies? I can’t decide if it’s stupid or lazy… anyhoo… nope nope nope.
Because Scott Lang has been doing podcasts. Keep up, Jon.
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I think we may be rather skewed in that area by the comics, where whatever insanity happens in New York everyone immediately acts as if nothing happened. Whereas in real life if you could use 9-11 as a comparison every tiny facet is investigated, reported on and dramatised and still is after 20 years.
It’s a significant change to the comics but I think the suspension of disbelief if you don’t come from years of reading them is that most of the time (there are exceptions like Civil War or the Mutant Registration Act) the public and media kind of look the other way and are completely uncurious.
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I was a little dubious beforehand that anyone on MCU Earth would know enough about Captain Marvel to be a super-fan of her. I think this episode breezily got away with it. People know enough and, speaking as someone who always seems to end up a fan of a minor secondary character rather than the star, I guess some would inevitably be Carol Danvers fans, even if it means filling in some blanks.
And it makes sense people would know about the big events. I can definitely see how there would have been public enquiries into what happened with the battle against Thanos let alone things like the Buzzfeed doing “an oral history of the battle of New York” or whatever. And then someone like Lang doing podcasts getting the little details out there (and talking about Captain America’s ass) really does make sense. The movies and even the series just don’t have the space to show that same level of extraneous detail or ordinary perspectives that the comics do (which, thinking about it, would make an MCU version of Marvels a decent prospect). We just get to dip in like three times a year and see the significant bits, but the stuff like Avengers press conferences and Iron Man doing charity events and whatever probably all still happen unseen.
Also, it’s TV show just having some self-referential fun, so ::shrug::.
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The movies and even the series just don’t have the space to show that same level of extraneous detail or ordinary perspectives that the comics do (which, thinking about it, would make an MCU version of Marvels a decent prospect).
It’s why I think it’s a shame that Alias/Jessica Jones was done on Netflix with such minimal wider-MCU content, as that kind of street-level view of the Marvel Universe provided a lot of fun moments in the comics.
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I think it’s fair to question Cap’s catchphrase being common knowledge but generally yeah that is how it would actually go. You can read detailed accounts of the death of Bin Laden even though there’s not a second of footage and no independent witnesses.
Cap as a government connected witness would 1000% be asked to testify to Congress on TV why half the population turned to dust and there is no story reason why he wouldn’t tell the whole truth. He has nothing to cover up, a lunatic alien did it.
The comics have lived on this often unecessary secrecy and public disinterest 90% of the time as it does with the illusion of aging because they can and it serves some story benefits. Live action in the 21st century can’t do the same. Characters have had to move on, legacy has to be used, if Dr Strange has a fight with a demon in a New York street it will have 2bn views on social media and everyone in the world will know him.
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Yeah, I have no problem with Cap’s little catchphrase being well known to the public. The Avengers are a big deal in the MCU, and Stark alone never shut up when he was alive. It’s very reasonable that it came up in interviews over the years. Then it was in the Avengers musical, which would have further spread it into the public consciousness. Of all the things to gripe about with Marvel stuff, this one doesn’t even phase me.
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Why some Christians are trying to cancel ‘Ms. Marvel’
Someone posted this screenshot on Facebook:
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Cap as a government connected witness would 1000% be asked to testify to Congress on TV why half the population turned to dust
Does it advance the story? NO could it happen in the 5 years of the snap without the audience knowing? YES Do you want an incredibly long movie get even longer? NO
I think the actor playing Kamala is great. The community she lives in is well fleshed out. I look forward to more episodes in this world.
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Can we stop giving attention to stupid bastards who are only saying mad shit to get it?
OK then, back to the show.
This was a great start and a very smart adaptation.
As to the whole idea of Avengerscon, it works well. Hawkeye established that a generation has grown up with all kinds of crap going on around them. Plus, Captain America: The Musical. This simple extends those ideas further.
The temporal aspect that they are now delving into sets the films apart from the comics in a very smart way.
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The first episode was pretty good. I just hope they can keep it up when they have to start telling a superhero story with a villain, which I assume they will do.
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I enjoyed it. It was a lot of fun and the actress playing Kamala really makes the show. I can see how this would be very popular with younger generations.
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I’m really enjoying this so far, it’s effortlessly charming, Iman Vellani has a fantastic screen presence, it’s funny and the character work is fantastic. And how many times do we have stuff like a positive, thoughtful look at Muslim culture in an action/adventure show? Or a frank and mature discussion of puberty and menstruation? This and Hawkeye are miles ahead of the other Disney+ Marvel shows so far, worthy of being considered in canon with Agents of SHIELD
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I agree Lorcan. This and Hawkeye are the superior Disney + MCU shows.
I get why it may not be everyone’s cup of tea, it is more teen drama than superheroics so far but they share in common sharp scripts and a lot of chemistry between the actors. I think the changes to the character are actually better than the comic (which I really liked), her origin came out that failed period of trying to replace mutants with Inhumans and the ancestry angle is more interesting.
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Damn, why are Damage Control such dicks in this universe?
Still loving the show though. And I’m enjoying Kamala’s rejigged powers/origin.
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I agree Lorcan. This and Hawkeye are the superior Disney + MCU shows.
I get why it may not be everyone’s cup of tea, it is more teen drama than superheroics so far but they share in common sharp scripts and a lot of chemistry between the actors. I think the changes to the character are actually better than the comic (which I really liked), her origin came out that failed period of trying to replace mutants with Inhumans and the ancestry angle is more interesting.
The school drama stuff really makes me think of the classic Spider-Man stories where his home problems are at least as important as fighting Doc Ock or whoever, but updated to be a bit more modern and also opening an window into an often under-represented demographic (who happens to be a Muslim, boom boom). It’s not the kind of story I’d gravitate too but the writing and performances elevate it and it’s just so much fun.
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I never read a Ms. Marvel comic, so I don’t know if the screen version is a faithful presentation of the character. What I do know is that I am really enjoying this series — the visual style, the deep dive into Kamala’s character and family and neighborhood and culture, and the pace of the unfolding story. I love how the Muslim community in Jersey City is treated as just that — a community, full of individuals with actual personalities as opposed to stereotypes, as neighbors and parents and siblings and friends. Have we ever seen this in an MCU production before? Nothing comes to mind that is even halfway close to what the Ms. Marvel show is giving us.
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ehhhhh… the muslim family seemed awfully steretypical to me… well in the first episode at least.
This and Hawkeye are miles ahead of the other Disney+ Marvel shows so far, worthy of being considered in canon with Agents of SHIELD
lol is that supposed to be praise? mmmkay.
Well, glad you guys are enjoying… I misclicked on the thread xD
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I never read a Ms. Marvel comic, so I don’t know if the screen version is a faithful presentation of the character.
While it makes changes for the origin and powers it’s otherwise extremely faithful to the comic.
The characters look and behave pretty much exactly as they do in print. The tone of the book, the approach to the race/religion aspects and the fact that most of the time the superheroics take a back seat to the teen drama stuff are pretty much exactly the same.
I don’t know if it is because it is the most recent lead character they’ve adapted, the book is just over 8 years old, but apart from the distancing from The Inhumans it has the least tinkering of any MCU stuff I’d say.
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There’s another recent reference too in Dr Strange.
I’m not suggesting they are banned but the Ms Marvel origin comes from a rather convoluted crossover storyline about the Terrigen mists arriving on Earth. That storyline was in place because Ike Perlmutter was angry any new mutants being invented in the comics became property of Fox for film and isn’t particularly important to the character, the Inhuman aspect is rarely referenced in the comic again after that.
So I mean more that I fully understand why the MCU version wouldn’t spend a huge amount of time setting up that story, on the back of one of their few properties that really bombed.
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Can’t say I was expecting Clan Destine to be bolted onto Kamala’s backstory in place of the Inhumans. I know literally nothing about them beyond the name and that Alan Davis made them, so have zero issue with it. They did go from “nicely asking for help” to “YOU BETRAYED US!!!1!” unconvincingly quickly though.
Oh and I guess Kamala’s bangle is a Nega-Band, actually giving her a tangential connection to Captain Marvel, which is maybe a smart move. Maybe unnecessary.
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Oh and I guess Kamala’s bangle is a Nega-Band, actually giving her a tangential connection to Captain Marvel, which is maybe a smart move.
That was the link I assumed when they switched to the bracelet. The first Captain Marvel comic I ever read was an old UK annual reprint with the nega-bands and Rick Jones so it stuck in my mind.
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Oh and I guess Kamala’s bangle is a Nega-Band, actually giving her a tangential connection to Captain Marvel, which is maybe a smart move.
That was the link I assumed when they switched to the bracelet. The first Captain Marvel comic I ever read was an old UK annual reprint with the nega-bands and Rick Jones so it stuck in my mind.
It didn’t really occur to me until Clan Destine mentioned it’s meant to be a pair and took it off a severed blue arm.
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Can’t say I was expecting Clan Destine to be bolted onto Kamala’s backstory in place of the Inhumans.
It doesn’t seem really much to do with it (I read Clan Destine recently). None of the characters or background are at all the same really apart from the long-lived aspect.
In fact it is so far from the source I am more prone to think they are just using the general word ‘clandestine’ because they remain underground.
Like Dave I also made the mental leap that were nega bands when they were shown in the trailer.
Edit: Actually I forgot Adam Destine married a Djinn so his offspring are descended, that is another slight link but the comic is about a British guy who gains immortality and his family. They are not from another dimension.
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Okay, it is a very very distant one but I guess there is the Djinn connection.
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I really liked this week’s episode, but it definitely feels like they should have been given more than six episodes. I want them to get past the origin setup story and just have her on adventures, and it’s clear there’s not going to be time for that.
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I really liked this week’s ep. It was the little details that sold it, like the guy on the plane in the middle pulling up his paper while Kamala and her Mum go at it. Then they land and it kicks off between Mum and Gran….
The handling and the legacy of the partition is interesting here too. It’s not an area that gets much attention in the UK, or not that I recall.
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The handling and the legacy of the partition is interesting here too. It’s not an area that gets much attention in the UK, or not that I recall.
It was addressed quite memorably in that Doctor Who episode not that long ago.
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The handling and the legacy of the partition is interesting here too. It’s not an area that gets much attention in the UK, or not that I recall.
Outside of communities who are still impacted by it, I truly doubt most people know anything about it. My personal knowledge regarding the Partition is very sketchy at best.
Cheers to the creators for bringing this to a wider audience.
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The handling and the legacy of the partition is interesting here too. It’s not an area that gets much attention in the UK, or not that I recall.
It was addressed quite memorably in that Doctor Who episode not that long ago.
So memorably that it slips my mind entirely so which one was it Dave?
Edit – Google seems to suggest it was Demons of the Punjab, broadcast in 2018! Not exactly recent.
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That’s the one. It stuck in my mind as I thought it addressed the subject quite well.
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Outside of communities who are still impacted by it, I truly doubt most people know anything about it. My personal knowledge regarding the Partition is very sketchy at best.
I think that’s true Todd, even in the UK where there is a much bigger (proportion wise at least) South Asian community it is rarely if ever covered. That Doctor Who episode Dave mentions and the original Ms Marvel comics are where most of my initial knowledge come from.
There’s a very large Indian community here in Malaysia but watching this episode last week my wife and kids asked me to explain what ‘partition’ was. My wife’s maid of honour and my daughter’s BBF are Indian, they aren’t insulated from the culture at all, but it still isn’t well known.
I would say though, and not in any way as some supporter of Empire, but putting it all on British administrators is a bit simplistic, getting out a ruler to divide up countries has never ended well but was also not a random whim of some bored Etonian (in India, Israel or Northern Ireland). It generally came out of existing conflict and 70+ years after Indian independence the current BJP administration trades a lot on Hindu v Muslim conflict.
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I think that’s true Todd, even in the UK where there is a much bigger (proportion wise at least) South Asian community it is rarely if ever covered. That Doctor Who episode Dave mentions and the original Ms Marvel comics are where most of my initial knowledge come from. There’s a very large Indian community here in Malaysia but watching this episode last week my wife and kids asked me to explain what ‘partition’ was. My wife’s maid of honour and my daughter’s BBF are Indian, they aren’t insulated from the culture at all, but it still isn’t well known.
Yes, a lot of my knowledge of it originally came through fiction too. For me the first time I really came to understand it was when I read Midnight’s Children by Salman Rushdie, which deals with that era in some detail.
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I’m guessing episode 5 is a marmite episode. I love it, in my covid haze. Many aspects on family: found, lost, regained.
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I’m guessing episode 5 is a marmite episode. I love it, in my covid haze. Many aspects on family: found, lost, regained.
The whole “sacrifice self to stop the bad thing” was too rushed, but the rest was good. Again, I wish it wasn’t over next week. This should be an actual TV show, not some event series that’s over in a few hours.
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I’m hot and cold on it, the whole Clan Destine/Djinn stuff is feeling incredibly pointless in such a short show, because there’s now a lot of mileage to cover in the last episode. It’s another one where it feels like they’ve smushed two series’ worth of story into one. I’ve seen the suggestion elsewhere that series 1 should have just been Kamala dealing with Damage Control and becoming Jersey’s resident hero, and then had the origin of her powers for series 2.
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Each episode is worse than the previous one. Maybe that is because I liked the story about a fangirl who gets superpowers and tries to be a superhero, and am totally indifferent to the story about djinns who want to get back to their home dimension. They had a good thing, and replaced it with exposition dumps and flashbacks.
I really hope the last episode gets back on track.
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Very fun finale, that definitely makes me want more of the show, and I’m annoyed we probably won’t see Kamala again for a year (The Marvels is end of July 2023), and the show won’t be back until sometime after that.
That “mutation” line at the end (with the X-Men theme playing!) is a mean tease, but if it means Kamala gets to be part of some future X-Men movie/series I’m all for it.
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Yeah, I agree. There was a lot that was enjoyable in that finale (and the series as a whole) although some bits needed work. The motivation for the Damage Control agent seemed kinda thin (and then suddenly the other one we know is a) her boss and b) reasonable?). There needed to be more dialogue from Kamran as he started to go “less lethal” fending off Damage Control expressing his angst etc. It was a tad under-written there.
I was a little surprised by the mutant bit. They did so much work to disentangle her from the Inhumans and build her own backstory, to then hint at an X-Men connection (when we’ve had pretty much nothing of MCU X-Men beyond alt. reality fan service Xavier) seems unnecessary.
But I loved most of the series. The teen hero elements, the visuals stylistics, the Jersey City community and Kamala’s family and friends (especially her father, who is brilliant) is all great and I want to see more of it. Captain Marvel 2 becoming “The Marvels” seemed like a bit of a ploy to counter-balance the (largely misogynistic) backlash Captain Marvel got, but on the basis of Ms Marvel it does at least have the potential to make it a better film.
I figured Carol would show up at in a teaser at the end, but it being a Mar-Vell/Rick style switch was interesting.
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The last episode was ok, but it felt rushed, since they had wasted two episodes in Pakistan that could have been put to better use. And the whole djinn plot was incredibly uninspired, and got solved in a total anticlimax.
All six episodes in New Jersey with a more mundane threat could have been great.
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Xavier: The mutant delegation selects Ms. Marvel for the mutant draft.
Black Bolt: No, she's Inhuman!
Xavier: Don't nobody care about yall Inhumans. When the last time yall been relevant? I'll wait. We giving Kamala's shoulders a rest, she been carrying yall for too long. pic.twitter.com/NpB8m7bfJp
— Black Nerd Problems (@BlkNrdProblems) July 14, 2022
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Wow… they really used the mutant card on Miss Marvel? okay I guess… still not watching it, though… xD
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Wow… they really used the mutant card on Miss Marvel? okay I guess… still not watching it, though… xD
It might not be to your taste, Jon, but I actually think MS. MARVEL is the best Disney+ MCU series to date; which, admittedly, is a bit of a backhanded compliment. I feel like this one got closest to the right balance of action, effects, characterization, and pacing. It isn’t perfect, but even my sister-in-law (who doesn’t know Wolverine from Wonder Woman) enjoyed the heck out of it.
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I did love Ms Marvel. But the last episode, the school stuff was awful.
No TV show can do boring school shenanigans post-Community – they had bikes, tennis ball machines, but it was neither exciting or funny.The home stuff, just has the comics has it, is lovely, I loved much of the story in Pakistan, but battles in the school, must try harder
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I just caught up after my hols.
Watched with the family and they loved it, unsung MVP was the imam especially when he was trying out Tik Tok and hoped the hot dog was halal.
Overall I really enjoyed it, the character dynamics were great, it did have the issue a lot of Marvel stuff has, the villains weren’t very good, both the Djinn and the DC woman had pretty weak motivations. Its strength really was the character work, aided by both the acting and script. I liked the Pakistan stuff, it was an interesting glimpse into something we rarely see on screen.
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In some ways, this was the best-made Marvel series yet. There was an immense attention to detail in the direction – exactly the kind of thing that was missing in many of the Marvel shows – and the main characters were beautifully fleshed out, with smart dialogue that really worked to show those characters. I loved everything about Kamala and her family and friends. (The mother’s actress was especially amazing.)
The powers were also nicely realised and made for some fun visuals. I was fine with the action generally. The villains and the overall plot were the great weakness of the show, but none of that really mattered to my enjoyment of it.
I also thought it was beautiful to see with what ease they established this Pakistani American environment, as well as a hero with a normal body type, and managed to put in a lot of Indian-Pakistani history without any of it being grating or feeling like a history lesson.
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this was the best-made Marvel series yet
Yes, I agree.
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