There was a limited episode 1 premiere last night and the full series hits next Friday, 7 May. Discuss the show here.
Jupiter’s Legacy on Netflix – SPOILER discussion
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Publishers like Image have designers, marketing teams, legal teams, relationships with printing companies, distributors, retailers, and so on.
Companies like Millarworld have none of those things which is why they need publishers to publish things.
Or maybe both of them are accurately described as publishing companies.
To save any wasting any more time with this slightly silly discussion, here is Millarworld’s entry at Companies House.
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Sounds like some very mixed messages were sent before and after on this.
If they knew they only had the one set of 8 episodes, I think the series would look very different.
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I’ve never been a particular personal cheerleader for Millar (even though I’ve enjoyed a lot of his stuff), but I can recognise that he’s done well just to get as much made as he has already – some of it being pretty successful to boot.
Indeed… outside of Lee and Kirby (and maybe Alan Moore… and Kirkman in sheer quantity) he might be the most “adapted” CB creator… and all of it was his own, too, until recently. He already had Wanted, KickAss 1 & 2 and Kingsmen 1 & 2 before the Netflix aquisition… and that’s not counting all the inspiration the MCU took from his Marvel works, and stuff like the animated Red Son.
So yeah, like him or not, he really has been one of the most succesful CB creators ever, and good for him.
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Steve Sensible wrote:
What the hell did they spend $200 million on?? Certainly not the cast! Or those costumes!
Catering.
Those had to be some pretty good sandwiches!!
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I wish Netflix wasn’t so gung-ho on the “dump” model. I’d just gotten around to watching the first couple episodes and liked it enough that I would have watched one here and there for the next couple weeks. Nope, now of course I won’t bother.
Been quite a few shows canceled before I could watch them a couple months later. True, I did not feel compelled to watch 8 episodes in a weekend. But the novelty of doing that was worn off. Expecting me to do so kind of defeats their whole idea of watching on my own schedule.
Their library is vast but stuffed with stuff I won’t start because I know it ends prematurely.
From the comments it sounds like the show had plenty of other problems but I think the release model was one of them. I also think it encourages (on some level) the padding. So many Netflix shows have like treading water for 45 minutes, just to get to a cliffhanger, and repeat.
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Their library is vast but stuffed with stuff I won’t start because I know it ends prematurely.
That is a fair point. It reminds me actually of looking through an Image Comics linewide sale on Comixology, there’s tons of interesting looking books on there that never finish.
It is really hard to get up the enthusiasm to watch any show that has been cancelled prematurely (as in there’s no ending). I did do it for The OA, I think that’s the only time.
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As soon as DeKnight left, I suspected something was wrong. then the delays(or just the time that passed). so not surprised. 1-2 were ok. 3-5 were bad, 6-8 were the way they were because i believe Netflix were bullshitted(we are going to extend this out so we can make more seasons. We are going to make so much money). The whole Blackstar storyline was bullshit. Tell the story that sold thousands if not millions of comics. after ep.2, Blackstar should have been history, Hutch should have been introduced no later than the Funeral as a non powered friend who grew up with Brandon and Chloe. then pump up the SkyFox story. In the past, resolve the deformed Dad story in the first couple of eps. Bring the Union on halfway through then show the cracks that Circle discussed.
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Would Netflix allow that kind of statement to be published?
It won’t be a question.
Millar works on the Stan Lee template of hype and they are similar in that not everything works, Lee revitalised a publishing company, left to promote it in Hollywood he achieved a couple of shitty cartoons and pillowcase deal.
He ploughed through it upbeat that the next thing will be great and Millar will too but in truth why not?
Millar has had more hits than misses in comics and TV so he’ll never dwell on this, just as he glossed over the disappointing sequels to Kick Ass and Kingsman. He could write a text page at the back of his comic apologising for a TV show he didn’t make or do what I would and ignore it.
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Imagine that Jon Favreau’s Iron Man opened in theatres in May of 2008 and both topped the weekend box office and bombed at the box office. Not “gee, we hoped it would open better,” but outright tanked. And then, on that Monday morning, Marvel Studios announced that while there would be no Iron Man 2, they were giving audiences and “fans” a full-blown Marvel Cinematic Universe, one which might contain Iron Man and his supporting cast at some point in time. That’s essentially what happened yesterday with Netflix’s reportedly $200 million, eight-episode superhero show Jupiter’s Legacy.
The first show in Netflix’s pricy attempts to create a cinematic universe out of Mark Millar-specific comic properties has been cancelled even as it topped the weekly Nielsen lists among original shows (696 million minutes over eight episodes totaling 359 minutes). The spin is not that it’s been “canceled,” but that we’re getting a spin-off, Supercrooks. So instead of a second season to a show which earned lousy reviews and apparently poor enough post-debut viewership to not get a second season, we’re getting a whole Millarworld universe.
It would be like Universal announcing The Dark Universe after The Mummy bombed.
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I agree the spin that it’s continuing in another form is a poor idea, you’d be wiser to distance things from a cancelled show. We know there isn’t a real Millar universe anyway aside from his little easter eggs.
Supercrooks is basically Ocean’s 11 with superpowers and the superpowers are all it shares with JL.
It probably doesn’t matter that much though, the vast majority checking out new shows on Netflix won’t know or care about any of that.
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Pretty disappointed it was cancelled, even for all it’s flaws I really enjoyed the performances, especially the “Circle” portions of the story. (I’m a sucker for a period piece!)
I was really looking forward to seeing the stories from JC2 brought to screen, that was probably my favorite run of the Jupiter’s series. At least I got to see one scene with a live action Skyfox.
This seemed like a wasted opportunity.
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Would Netflix allow that kind of statement to be published?
It won’t be a question.
Millar works on the Stan Lee template of hype and they are similar in that not everything works, Lee revitalised a publishing company, left to promote it in Hollywood he achieved a couple of shitty cartoons and pillowcase deal.
He ploughed through it upbeat that the next thing will be great and Millar will too but in truth why not?
Millar has had more hits than misses in comics and TV so he’ll never dwell on this, just as he glossed over the disappointing sequels to Kick Ass and Kingsman. He could write a text page at the back of his comic apologising for a TV show he didn’t make or do what I would and ignore it.
True, Millar is good at the “what burning car? I’m talking about my new rocket car over here, it’s fantastic” method.
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‘Jupiter’s Legacy’ is over, and its cast members are not taking the cancellation well
Josh Duhamel’s response
“When you get dumped by @netflix and have to put yourself back out there ….
#sexysantasummer
What’s up, @hulu?”
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Netflix Should Continue Jupiter’s Legacy as an Animated Series
The character designs would definitely have to be simplified. I don’t see Frank Quitely’s style working in animation all that well.
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I know they’ll never release the information but I’d love to see the numbers for the series. It must have crashed so spectacularly.
I don’t know if it had to crash so hugely. It was number 1 in many countries and the analysis seemed to show decent impressions. The slow pace may have shown drop off though.
I think it’s more the Superman Returns effect though, a film that sold as many tickets as Marvel movies like Thor and Cap did a couple of years later but the budget was so high it needed to do twice that to make any money. One article I read said the primary metric Netflix use is cost to number of views, just doing ‘ok’ isn’t good enough, if you spend Game of Thrones money you need Game of Thrones buzz and ratings and not say Lucifer numbers.
It’ll be similar with Amazon’s LOTR show, albeit they seem less eager with the axe than Netflix, it won’t do to get average ratings, they’ll have to be blockbuster to justify it.
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‘Jupiter’s Legacy’: Battles Over Budgets, Executive Purge Factor in Cancellation
Jupiter’s Legacy hit Netflix on May 7 to great expectations. The show, which adapts a well-regarded comic by Mark Millar, was the first project to emerge from Netflix’s 2017 acquisition of Millar’s publishing line, Millarworld. Unlike most of Millar’s other works, the superhero comic, with a story that spans decades and prequel titles, had a deep character bench from which to draw, and Netflix saw it as a way to further its own universe-building ambitions to compete with Disney IP heavyweights Marvel and Star Wars. And it was to be a flagship show for the cornerstone of its Millarworld ambitions.
On June 2, however, Jupiter was no more, with the streamer informing the cast that they were being let go as the series garnered a less-than-stellar 38 percent critics’ score on review aggregator Rotten Tomatoes.
The show, however, seemed to be a victim of several factors, some of its own making, some not, and illustrates the birthing pains of building on a highly publicized acquisition.
The series was plagued with issues from the start, with then-showrunner Steven DeKnight initially asking Netflix for a budget that would see at least a $12 million per episode spend, according to sources. The streamer, however, backed him into an area of under $9 million.
It wasn’t long into shooting that the show found itself overbudget and running behind, with DeKnight, never one to shy away from speaking his mind, according to people who have worked with him, clashing with Netflix over “creative differences.” The production was shut down about halfway through its eight-episode shoot; DeKnight was replaced by Sang Kyu Kim, who then had to retool the first batch of episodes.
Issues didn’t stop there, however, as even after wrapping production, the show spent an inordinate amount of time of 2020 in post-production. Louis Leterrier, the filmmaker behind Netflix’s acclaimed Dark Crystal and Lupin series, was brought in at the 11th hour as a consultant, according to sources, but it was seen as too late to save the troubled show.
With episode spends now reaching even above what DeKnight was originally asking for, show insiders say he was proven right in some respects.
“Marvel shows are $15 million to $20 million per episode,” notes one producer working in the comic book space. “If you’re going to make a big superhero show, you need at least that much.”
It is unclear in what range the final budget landed. A Netflix insider pegged it closer to $130 million for the season, but with the cost of shutting down production and long post-time, several sources peg it upwards of $200 million.
To compound problems, Netflix then underwent an executive shuffle that saw its greenlighter, vp original content Cindy Holland, and its two original executive overseers exit the company. Holland was replaced last fall by veteran Bela Bajaria, who took the mantle as head of global TV. As is the norm with many a shuffle, any project not part of an incoming exec’s portfolio will be scrutinized. “Unless the show is an undisputed hit, it’s going to fall under the microscope,” says one Jupiter insider.
When Jupiter was canceled, some observers presumed bad metrics were the cause. But a day after the cancellation, Nielsen showed Jupiter atop its streaming chart, generating 696 million minutes of view time in the week of May 3-9, better than Hulu’s The Handmaid’s Tale (690 million) and other original series from Netflix, Hulu, Amazon Prime and Disney+. And Jupiter was, for a while, a fixture on Netflix’s own public top 10 chart visible to subscribers, although that metric is vague as it is not clear if it’s measuring watched episodes or simple samples or acting as a visibility booster.
Millar and Netflix spun the cancellation by saying Jupiter is going to be a universe, with a new live-action series — based on an unrelated Millar comic titled Supercrooks — given a series order and folded under a Jupiter umbrella. Several rival executives questioned why you would lasso yourself to a failed launch but others noted it does allow the company to sail the initial awareness winds generated by Jupiter while still allowing Bajaria, with Supercrooks and bringing back the sidelined project, The Magic Order, to put her own stamp on Millarworld.
The other criticism lobbed at the process is that it has revealed that Millarworld, despite having a creative IP factory in Millar, lacks a seasoned and muscled producer or executive that can really steer the division. A Netflix insider insists that the company is invested in Millarworld for the long haul, noting building franchises takes time and that even vaunted brands such as Star Wars and DC have stumbles.
So in the end, was there an audience for the show or not? Netflix isn’t saying, and viewers may have to wait until Supercrooks arrives to find out.
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When Jupiter was canceled, some observers presumed bad metrics were the cause. But a day after the cancellation, Nielsen showed Jupiter atop its streaming chart, generating 696 million minutes of view time in the week of May 3-9, better than Hulu’s The Handmaid’s Tale (690 million) and other original series from Netflix, Hulu, Amazon Prime and Disney+.
These metrics are always nonsense, and it’s never been clear how Nielsen calculates any of it, but it’s especially odd to compare a US-only show to an international show.
“Marvel shows are $15 million to $20 million per episode,” notes one producer working in the comic book space. “If you’re going to make a big superhero show, you need at least that much.”
This is a dumb amount of money to spend.
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Or neither… it’s not like they spent billions… But no, I don’t think Netflix thought they had the next Marvel, however, Millar has proven his track record more than most, so that acquisition was sound… I’m assuming they’ll eventually get the rights back to everything Millar-related and they’ll be able to milk all of it… I have to say though, they haven’t really done much with it and their first outing seems to be a total bust, so
Also, once more this shows why Feige is such a valuable guy… because if you don’t have someone like him, who can get shit done and done well, your massive (or small) IP library ain’t worth much… I mean, shit, look at DC/WB and the ungodly messes they’ve created.
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These metrics are always nonsense, and it’s never been clear how Nielsen calculates any of it, but it’s especially odd to compare a US-only show to an international show.
I very recently read how Nielsen get the streaming stats, it’s the old fashioned way they and BARB get network TV ratings, they have a sample of a few thousand families who report back what they watch and then expand the number out for the potential audience.
(My family was actually selected back in the late 80s. It’s probably higher tech nowadays but they sent us a book with the TV listings for each week and then we wrote in next to the ones we’d watched and sent it back, they sent a few quid for it which was pretty easy money. The method and focus on using families though did make me wonder if stuff like the ‘red triangle’ films on Channel 4 were under-reported because dad didn’t want that written down for all to see).
Saying that 696m minutes isn’t exactly the most useful statistic, I have no idea how that compares to anything else apart from the example in the article. It would be simpler just to count viewers who had watched past a certain point.
I take it that when Netflix bought up Millarworld, they thought they had the next Marvel to run off shows from like Disney. Did they overestimate or did Millar hoodwink them?
They spent roughly $40m buying Millarworld, a lot of money to us and Millar and his artists, but it’s less than 1% of the $4.24bn Disney paid for Marvel.
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