Doctor Who – What The Flux?

Topic

I remember when 2020 seemed a long way away!

Hope we get some news soon on exactly when this is coming.

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Well, that looks jolly exciting.

I changed my avatar to one of the still from the Tom Baker classic Pyramids of Mars.

I used to watch it on PBS all the time.

Now, I heard of this BritBox service online to watch old Dr. Who.

Does anyone know more about it?

I do know more Al. Britbox is a collaboration between the two main network channels in the UK, BBC and ITV, to put their back catalogues out for streaming.

As with any streaming service the value is in how much of their content you want to watch and the cleverest way really for VFM is sporadically sign up and leave. I signed up for Disney+ for a 3 month package the other day and cancelled Amazon Prime. At the end of it I will likely switch them around after I have seen all the series I want to at Disney and catch The Expanse and a few other things on Amazon (including their comics). Then switch again.

So if you fancy a classic Who binge, sign up to Britbox, binge and then cancel, then maybe come back later when you want to again.

 

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Al-x

When I saw the old Pyramids of Mars… it bought me back to seemingly happier times when Tom was the Doctor and Sarah Jane was the companion. Now I want to get a few more old episodes of early Tom Baker and I might get Britbox in time.

Old Dr. Who – always the TARDIS would materialize in a quarry or medieval Earth. The Daleks, Cybermen, Sontarrans when they were really a dangerous threat. The outer space special effects were really bad miniature work but it has a charm to watch it again…

John Pertwee was Ok but in his earlier years (the BBC budget) made it so that he was “punished” by the Timelords and his adventures were confined/stuck to Earth where he worked as this consultant to UNIT and the Brigadeer Stewart. He Doctor style was influenced by James Bond. The Pertwee stories got better when his punishment was lifted and he really traveled. Then there was the rivalry with his bad counterpart, the Master.

Nostalgia can be Ok after all.

https://twitter.com/bbcdoctorwho/status/1452704011203727361?s=21

Jesus, this is just… I mean you’ve got John Bishop basically playing himself (as he said on the One Show while talking about not being a trained actor) and the one clip you use to promote his addition to the show and the new series entirely is… him telling a weird trick or treater to go away? How bad is the rest of the show if this is they sizzle clip?

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Dave

Certainly a strange move to release a deleted scene before the episode airs.

Tune in next week, kids, when John Bishop double checks the bus timetable and has a brief moan with the old lady at the bus stop about how they’re never on time these days!  All-action, all-budget!

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Todd, Martin Smith

saga wrote:

Tune in next week, kids, when John Bishop double checks the bus timetable

This is the great thing about Doctor Who, it can literally tell any story it wants to and you never get the same thing week-to-week.

I’m looking forward to the episode where he gets a “sorry we missed you” card through the letterbox from Hermes despite having waited in for his parcel all morning. Imagine the drama!

Martin Smith wrote:

How bad is the rest of the show if this is they sizzle clip?

Also, I think we probably already know the answer to this, given that ahead of the new series the BBC have chucked out the showrunner and replaced him with the guy they last hired when they needed to resurrect the show from utter death.

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Martin Smith

Tremendously exciting to know that we’ll more than likely have to wait until some point in 2023 for the show to possibly become appointment viewing again. By then we should have that new Lidl store opened in our town!

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Todd

It’s a very weird clip to share.

I don’t really have a problem though with Bishop saying he’ll play himself, a large number of actors do, including a lot of the most bankable Hollywood stars. I actually first encountered him as an actor on Skins playing one of the dads and didn’t know he was a comedian (although nearly all the parents in that show were), I thought he was good.

I don’t necessarily think Bishop will be bad (we’ve invoked Catherine Tate enough times in these threads to know how these things can work out) but I hope that clip isn’t his outstanding moment in the show.

Yeah, the idea of casting a comedian isn’t in and of itself a problem, even if they are largely playing themselves (hell, Ken Dodd did that, but just for an extended cameo and his character was at least meant to be an alien). But it’s just the accumulation of all those elements. It’s Chibnall’s final series, his chance to really go all out and stretch himself on the show, he has a vacant role that can be a) almost anyone and b) be used to give a good spotlight to a new or different actor, one that’s been used to launch so many careers and… he just casts a middle-aged white comedian to basically play himself. Following right on from another middle-aged white comedian. You’d have to assume he had loads of ideas he didn’t have chance to use for Graham, but from the ones I saw, it’s not like Graham had much to do half the time.

He had a chance to cast a middle-aged white comedian and Frankie Boyle was right there for the taking.  A missed opportunity.

It’s testament to how much I’ve cooled on the show lately that I keep forgetting the new series starts tonight.

Is it me or has this been relatively un-trumpeted compared to previous series launches?

That’s possibly because they didn’t give out the first episode to the press, so there’s been less promotion on that end. I’ve seen the trailer a fair few times. I guess perception of it is tied to how much you’re interested. If you’re already really excited about it coming back, each time you see the trailer is going to spike that.

Yeah, the mainstream coverage is what I’m thinking of and it seems way down.

I wonder why no screeners were sent out. Could there be a major revelation this episode? Or maybe it’s just awful.

(Yeah yeah, it can be two things etc.)

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Uncle Retrospective

same here, I don’t know if I’ll watch it. I was mostly okay with the first season, and loved the Ruthless Doctor set up and wanted to know where that went. But FFS cybertimelords. Not cool Chibbers, not cool.

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lorcan_nagle

Scariest bit so far? “written by Chris Chibnall”.

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lorcan_nagle

Ben wrote:

Scariest bit so far? “written by Chris Chibnall”.

Get used to it, he wrote the whole season, with a co-writer on one ep:

I enjoyed it more than most of Chibnall’s episodes, though I’m skeptical of it hanging together over six episodes. There were a lot of threads set up, and very little payoff so far.

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lorcan_nagle

That was a good opener.  Not perfect, some confusing sections and a really obvious cluffhanger you’ll see coming.  But a good few good bits in here too.

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lorcan_nagle

That didn’t really work for me. Felt like the first ten minutes of several different episodes all mashed together, and didn’t really go anywhere or have a cohesive story of its own to tell.

Claire has potential though, her character is nicely intriguing. And having movie-Galactus as a threat gives it all a nice epic scale.

Bishop was fine too, I guess, given the fairly thankless task of his underwritten character.

We’ll see where it goes but it wasn’t thrilling overall.

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lorcan_nagle

My daughter, two minutes after it finished: “I’ve already forgotten everything that happened in that.”

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lorcan_nagle, Uncle Retrospective, Ben, Todd

Dave wrote:

My daughter, two minutes after it finished: “I’ve already forgotten everything that happened in that.”

There’s your pull quote for the dvd box set.

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lorcan_nagle, Ben

Yeah I though that was alright. The weird Cenobite looking villains were a little goofy at times, but I’m interested in their backstory with the Doctor. The alien dogs saving humanity was a fun idea. And the CGI of people being dissolved and the Flux itself, all looked good. John Bishop was bloody terrible though.

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lorcan_nagle

That exceeded all my expectations and hit the giddy heights of “okay”. They really did push the idea that Dan is a good bloke a bit hard though.

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lorcan_nagle, Uncle Retrospective, Ben

I went in with very low expectations and was pleasantly surprised. Consider me intrigued as to where they go from here.

Can’t tolerate John Bishop’s anti-soup agenda, though. Love a good hot soup.

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Rocket, lorcan_nagle

I enjoyed it well enough, but Chibnall’s writing issues tend to be around pacing and ending a story satisfactorily, so a good opener isn’t all that weird for him.

If it doesn’t end with a nice bowl of homemade lentil soup and a crusty roll then it will all have been for nothing.

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Uncle Retrospective, Todd, lorcan_nagle

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Rocket, Todd, lorcan_nagle

The devil’s piss.

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Bruce, Uncle Retrospective, Todd, lorcan_nagle

Just caught up. I liked it.

Considering it’s one 6 part story I had no issue with the various setups flitting around and some of them started coming together towards the end. It actually felt quite Moffat but maybe with clearer storytelling than when he tended to go epic.

Yes it could all fall apart but for the moment it very much made me want to see the next one.

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Ben, Bruce

New episode was pretty good I thought – a decent historical romp with a nice alternate-history sci-fi angle with the Sontarans, and very good production values – some big epic scenes were handled well here, like the clashing armies or the Sontaran facilities in the modern day.

I’m also feeling a bit more positive on mashing up all of these stories into one saga – the return of Dog-Man was great and the spooky cliffhanger gave me flashbacks to the McCoy era.

I think this episode being a bit more focused on its main story (compared to the grab-bag of the first episode) helped.

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lorcan_nagle

Not as big a fan of episode two. Then again, I’ve never cared for the Sontarans – especially when they’re meant to be taken seriously as a big threat in a non-comedic episode. The episode could probably have been trimmed down to just the scenes with the triangles and the actual villains. Ah well, maybe things get back on track next time.

Is there meant to be a dog wookie alien assigned to protect Yaz?

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lorcan_nagle

This request came in my Quora feed:

https://www.quora.com/unanswered/What-would-the-doctor-think-of-Batman-Personally-I-think-he-wouldn-t-approve-of-him-or-his-methods-but-would-recognize-his-genius-and-bond-with-him-over-that

saga wrote:

when they’re meant to be taken seriously as a big threat in a non-comedic episode.

Dan running around with a wok dish as a weapon is serious?
Yaz’s dog guardian prolly gave up once Yaz started traveling with the Doctor. Dan met his guardian before he met the doctor. I liked WWTDD on Yaz’s hand.

Not at all but lumping the potato people in with some commentary about the horrors of the Crimean War doesn’t exactly work.

It didn’t work at all. all I got was “War is Bad, mmkay?” so i just let go of any serious meaning. I know they kept how famous that black woman was but her and the general were like NPCs to me.

[Al-x]

Watching old Tom Baker episodes and I am in heaven… Nostalgia!

Here is a snippet from Wikipedia on a story from that era:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matrix_(Doctor_Who)

The Matrix is first introduced in the 1976 serial The Deadly Assassin, twenty-three years before the release of the film The Matrix, six years before William Gibson’s 1982 “Burning Chrome”, eight years before Gibson’s novel Neuromancer and years before the advent of virtual reality in the 1980s.

I would add that 90s ds9 episode where the Dominion had the ds9 crew linked up in a virtual world

Talk about Dr Who being ahead of its time!!!

• This reply was modified 3 years, 2 months ago by Al-x.

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Todd

Well, that was a gigantic mess.

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Dave

Doctor Who Reaches A New Low, Series In Freefall

Yeah, that just felt like a bunch of random scenes thrown together. I had hoped only having six episodes and telling one story over them, would lead to a tighter plot with actual stakes. But instead last week and this week felt like filler, and the story doesn’t feel like it’s progressing at all.

An episode in which a lot of stuff happens very quickly and tries to disguise itself as character development. Magic.

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Ben

So I wasn’t as down on this episode as the rest of ye, but it still wasn’t great? Like I don’t feel like I wasted my time watching it but it could have been better. I liked Bel’s story and how it linked into Vinder’s, some of the time mucking about, and the revelations about the Ruth Doctor. It definitely feels like the point in an ongoing story that’s really stretched out and annoying in serial form, but isn’t as bad should you revisit it later – though of course the next three weeks are going to determine if anyone does.

Also, it’s pretty funny that the Doctor doesn’t listen to her enemies’ rants and spends the time monologuing.

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Ben

I thought it was a load of disjointed, barely-comprehensible guff this week. It doesn’t even feel like there’s a good story in there trying to get out.

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Ben

lorcan_nagle wrote:

and the revelations about the Ruth Doctor

I’m morbidly curious; what are these?

Martin Smith wrote:

lorcan_nagle wrote:

and the revelations about the Ruth Doctor

I’m morbidly curious; what are these?

It confirms that she was a pre-Hartnell regeneration, was working with Division at the time, lead a combat unit which captured Swarm and Azure, and Karvanista was part of that unit. Those scenes also explained who that one other guy was that showed up with Swarm and Azure last week.

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Martin Smith

Baffled as to why the show is introducing another character in Pregnant Space Lady when we’ve barely had a chance to get to know Dan and Yaz remains a blank slate.

Also, I can’t shake the idea that Vinder is Lister and this is all somehow a Red Dwarf story.

The scenes in the time stream certainly had a Red Dwarf budget.

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Todd

saga wrote:

Also, I can’t shake the idea that Vinder is Lister and this is all somehow a Red Dwarf story.

Ha, first time I saw the dreads I couldn’t help but think of Lister. Then I saw that he’s manning a space station in deep space, alone…

Honestly though, how great would a RD/DW crossover be? I can’t believe they never did it for Comic Relief but I guess RD was getting popular just as DW entered the wilderness years.

Now I would very much like to see Rimmer’s seething jealousy of the Doctor being such a know-it-all.

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Todd

saga wrote:

Now I would very much like to see Rimmer’s seething jealousy of the Doctor being such a know-it-all.

Absolutely. It’d be like Ace Rimmer x 1000.

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Todd

Yes…

I remember the City of Death arc… The Tom Baker years….

The Jagaroth!

😀

Much better ep this week.  Probably going to be a lot of scared kids from this one.

saga wrote:

Then again, I’ve never cared for the Sontarans – especially when they’re meant to be taken seriously as a big threat in a non-comedic episode. The episode could probably have been trimmed down to just the scenes with the triangles and the actual villains. Ah well, maybe things get back on track next time.

Funny… I am watching old John Pertwee which had the first appearance of the Sonatarans. In the story, the Sontarran crashes to Earth in Midieval times. He uses some devices from his ship to create a time portal to the 20th century and kidnaps scientists and equipment from there to help repair his ship. The Doctor and Sarah Jane (her debut episode) and UNIT note the disappearances and travel back. The Sontarran is also helping a Midieval lord to conquer the other kingdom by supplying him with robots to fight. The first time the Dr mentions his planet as Gallifrey and so on.

I miss old Dr. Who… Something to be said about nostalgia.

This week? Doctor Who? Doctor Poo more like.

Bruce wrote:

This week? Doctor Who? Doctor Poo more like.

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Todd

I thought this one was decent, the creepy atmosphere was very well done, but again, it’s not a self-contained story, it’s all going to hang together based on how well or badly the next two weeks go

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Ben, Dave

Yeah I agree. Decent individual episode and a great cliffhanger but I still don’t have faith that the Division stuff will work out.

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Ben, lorcan_nagle

“Division uses everything and everyone. Every species. Every world. Every moment. They are everywhere. Present and unseen. Division is unstoppable.”

Now thinking that Division is an allegory for Amazon. The Doctor and the Rogue Angel are fulfillment centre workers who have dared to take too long on their breaks.

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Ben, Todd

saga wrote:

“Division uses everything and everyone. Every species. Every world. Every moment. They are everywhere. Present and unseen. Division is unstoppable.”

Now thinking that Division is an allegory for Amazon. The Doctor and the Rogue Angel are fulfillment centre workers who have dared to take too long on their breaks.

Don’t you mean Kerblam!?

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Todd, Dave

Al-x wrote:

saga wrote:

Then again, I’ve never cared for the Sontarans – especially when they’re meant to be taken seriously as a big threat in a non-comedic episode. The episode could probably have been trimmed down to just the scenes with the triangles and the actual villains. Ah well, maybe things get back on track next time.

Funny… I am watching old John Pertwee which had the first appearance of the Sonatarans. In the story, the Sontarran crashes to Earth in Midieval times. He uses some devices from his ship to create a time portal to the 20th century and kidnaps scientists and equipment from there to help repair his ship. The Doctor and Sarah Jane (her debut episode) and UNIT note the disappearances and travel back. The Sontarran is also helping a Midieval lord to conquer the other kingdom by supplying him with robots to fight. The first time the Dr mentions his planet as Gallifrey and so on.

I miss old Dr. Who… Something to be said about nostalgia.

Fun fact for you, Al – Jeremy Bulloch, who went on to play Boba Fett is Hal the Archer in that story.

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Todd

Ha, I forgot about that episode. Now I miss Graham. At least we have Dan on hand to make useful contributions like poking the big spacey-timey thing with a stick. Go on yourself, Dan.

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lorcan_nagle

I would say that Bishop’s acting is bad but I’m not convinced I’ve actually seen him do any yet.

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Martin Smith, lorcan_nagle

saga wrote:

Ha, I forgot about that episode. Now I miss Graham. At least we have Dan on hand to make useful contributions like poking the big spacey-timey thing with a stick. Go on yourself, Dan.

Better a stick than your finger. For reference see the girl’s asshole foster father poking at the Weeping Angel

Anybody else suspecting that Not-Lister and Not-Kochanski are going to wind up being the parents of the Timeless Child?

Because if this results in the Doctor regenerating as a baby as those two careen around space and time as new parents, well, I think I’d be okay with that.

saga wrote:

Anybody else suspecting that Not-Lister and Not-Kochanski are going to wind up being the parents of the Timeless Child?

Because if this results in the Doctor regenerating as a baby as those two careen around space and time as new parents, well, I think I’d be okay with that.

I definitely had that in the back of my head last week, yeah

lorcan_nagle wrote:

Al-x wrote:

saga wrote:

Then again, I’ve never cared for the Sontarans – especially when they’re meant to be taken seriously as a big threat in a non-comedic episode. The episode could probably have been trimmed down to just the scenes with the triangles and the actual villains. Ah well, maybe things get back on track next time.

Funny… I am watching old John Pertwee which had the first appearance of the Sonatarans. In the story, the Sontarran crashes to Earth in Midieval times. He uses some devices from his ship to create a time portal to the 20th century and kidnaps scientists and equipment from there to help repair his ship. The Doctor and Sarah Jane (her debut episode) and UNIT note the disappearances and travel back. The Sontarran is also helping a Midieval lord to conquer the other kingdom by supplying him with robots to fight. The first time the Dr mentions his planet as Gallifrey and so on.

I miss old Dr. Who… Something to be said about nostalgia.

Fun fact for you, Al – Jeremy Bulloch, who went on to play Boba Fett is Hal the Archer in that story.

Cool!

Thanks

@lorcan_nagle … fellow

You truly are a gentleman and a scholar!

Details on this year’s New Year’s Special: https://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/mediapacks/christmas-tv-2021

The Thirteenth Doctor (Jodie Whittaker) and friends will kick-start 2022 with an action-packed spectacular episode set to air on BBC One on New Year’s Day. The festive special will feature guest stars Aisling Bea (This Way Up, Living With Yourself, Quiz), Adjani Salmon (Dreaming Whilst Black, Enterprice) and Pauline McLynn (Father Ted, Shameless).

Sarah (Aisling Bea) owns and runs ELF storage, and Nick (Adjani Salmon) is a customer who visits his unit every year on New Year’s Eve. This year, however, their night turns out to be a little different than planned…

The festive episode is the first of three Doctor Who Specials airing in 2022. The second Special airs in Spring and Jodie’s final feature-length Special (in where the Thirteenth Doctor will regenerate), will transmit in autumn 2022 as part of the BBC’s Centenary celebrations.

That definitely feels like it should be a Christmas episode.

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lorcan_nagle, Dave

Yeah it’s a shame that DW lost the Christmas Day slot under Chibnall. That sounds a lot more Christmassy than New Year-y.

It also looks like we won’t get any special next holidays, as that article says the final two Jodie eps will be in Spring and Autumn, so probably over a year after that until the RTD 60th Anniversary ep.

EDIT: 60th Anniversary Ep will be two years from today.

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Todd

That’ll be a first for NuWho won’t it? (Even during the big gap in the middle of Moffat/Capaldi’s run they did a Christmas special.)

That’s a shame.

Yep, they had episodes on Christmas every year from 2005 to 2017. Technically not in 2018 but that’s when they switched to New Year’s Day from 2019 onwards.

First Thaddea Graham, now Aisling Bea and Pauline McLynn. Within a couple of years Doctor Who is going to be all Irish, all the time.

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Todd, Dave

Lots of planets have an Irish.

saga wrote:

Lots of planets have an Irish.

I’m waiting for the next Doctor to have an Inner City Dublin accent and be getting up in Davros’ face going “are ye startin’?”

Oh wait, shit, I know who should be The Doctor – Blindboy from Rubberbandits.

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Ben

lorcan_nagle wrote:

First Thaddea Graham, now Aisling Bea and Pauline McLynn. Within a couple of years Doctor Who is going to be all Irish, all the time.

Wasn’t there that whole weird flashback thing during the Timeless Child episodes that appeared to be set in Ireland too?

Dave wrote:

lorcan_nagle wrote:

First Thaddea Graham, now Aisling Bea and Pauline McLynn. Within a couple of years Doctor Who is going to be all Irish, all the time.

Wasn’t there that whole weird flashback thing during the Timeless Child episodes that appeared to be set in Ireland too?

Yeah, we’re clearly on an accelerating Paddyfactor here.

saga wrote:

Lots of planets have an Irish.

All you have to do is go Up the Long Ladder to find them.

Widely predicted but now official

https://www.doctorwho.tv/news/?article=missing-adventure-the-abominable-snowmen-animation

 

 

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Martin Smith

And they’ve given it to one of the good animation studios instead of the one that churned out that dire Web of Fear recon.

Rocket wrote:

I know they kept how famous that black woman was but her and the general were like NPCs to me.

It’s actually a bit of a reflection on recent readings of history. Florence Nightingale is know globally for her nursing work in the Crimean War and while she got all the publicity Mary Seacole who was from Jamaica basically did the same thing but in our ‘lovely’ racist past was overlooked.

I’d say she’s still relatively obscure to most but of course the Doctor would know, as she knows everything, and it makes narrative sense Dan does as he was volunteering all that history guide stuff in episode one.

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Ben, lorcan_nagle

garjones wrote:

Rocket wrote:

I know they kept how famous that black woman was but her and the general were like NPCs to me.

It’s actually a bit of a reflection on recent readings of history. Florence Nightingale is know globally for her nursing work in the Crimean War and while she got all the publicity Mary Seacole who was from Jamaica basically did the same thing but in our ‘lovely’ racist past was overlooked.

I’d say she’s still relatively obscure to most but of course the Doctor would know, as she knows everything, and it makes narrative sense Dan does as he was volunteering all that history guide stuff in episode one.

Apparently she’s very well known inside the NHS as well, with at least one award and a bunch of hospital wards and other facilities all across the UK named after her.

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Ben

She’s big with kids too, I think. More of a fixture in the curriculum.

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Ben, garjones, Bruce, lorcan_nagle

I picked up the standard edition blu-ray of season 23 (the Trial of a Time Lord season) recently. The set has extended edits of every episode in the season, as well as a completely new edit of Terror of the Vervoids that removes all the trial sections.

It’s quite interesting to see it devoid of that stuff. While it’s hardly perfect, it’s a decent story when done “normally”. Once you get past the design of the Vervoids of course. As well as some new CGI exteriors of Hyperion III and a few other effects, the blu-ray team has made a new opening title sequence too. Same theme tune, logo, font and pictures of Colin Baker, but the gaudiness of his iteration of the starfield opening is reimagined as time vortex tunnel effect. It looks really nice and doesn’t feel too modern to fit with the rest.

lorcan_nagle wrote:

I thought this one was decent, the creepy atmosphere was very well done, but again, it’s not a self-contained story, it’s all going to hang together based on how well or badly the next two weeks go

It absolutely is.

I sense right now, and we know it will all change very soon when RTD returns, that Chibnall Who is not really getting a fair crack of the whip. I’ve really enjoyed this story so far, it has zero fat on the bones. If it can’t payoff in the last 2 episodes then fair enough but it seems to me the sins of past showrunners are rather forgiven in retrospect.

So far Flux is really good TV.

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lorcan_nagle

I don’t know if that’s fair. I think people (here and elsewhere) have acknowledged the stuff that works in Chibnall’s tenure as well as the stuff that doesn’t.

People seem to almost universally like elements such as the new Master and the Jo Martin Doctor, and more recently individual episodes of Flux like the Sontaran episode and the latest Weeping Angel episode have gone down well.

Other parts (like the grab-bag of episode three) have had a more mixed to negative reception.

I don’t think that’s indicative of Chibnall not getting a fair crack of the whip, I think it’s indicative of his run being fairly uneven, with bits that work and bits that don’t.

At this point I don’t think it’s anything to do with previous showrunners. We’re long past the Moffat era now and comparisons to past showrunners are not a big part of the criticism of the current era of the show. Chibnall has (for better or worse) made the version of the show he wanted to make, and people are reacting to that.

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lorcan_nagle

I guess so, I’m just really enjoying Flux so far – it’s very much better than the previous runs which I’ve said I found bland rather than bad a lot of the time – and it seems the response is mostly negative. It’s all opinion but I do find it hard to square that when typically there’s a bit more of a consensus on what’s good or isn’t in the show and I suppose I’m looking for what that gap is.

One thing that stands out that is different is the expectation and I suppose even I am doing that with a presumption the story may not have a payoff.

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Dave, lorcan_nagle

Yeah, I would agree that Flux is so far a bit of a step up from the previous Chibnall series. I wonder whether that comes from having fewer episodes this series and so being able to concentrate on a few key ideas with a bit more focus.

I do see what you’re saying about RTD’s return casting a bit of a shadow over this series – maybe some fans have already mentally moved on and just want to fast-forward to the next era – and it’s maybe a shame that Chibnall is doing some of his best stuff right at the end of his run.

But at the same time I still don’t think it’s great – Chibnall’s best still isn’t outstanding stuff – and I think there’s still some unevenness there.

Although I do wonder whether part of that unevenness also comes from the considerations of having to make Flux during a pandemic. It didn’t really occur to me until episode three (which featured a lot of disjointed scenes of actors either alone or in pairs/small groups) but I wonder to what extent the series had to be written and shot around those restrictions.

In terms of general overall reaction though I just find that kind of thing impossible to gauge these days as it largely seems to depend where you look. You’ll always get fans moaning (often a small group complaining loudly) and Chibnall doesn’t seem to be a favourite for a lot of viewers, but on the other hand a lot of the mainstream reviews and episode recaps that I’ve seen in recent weeks seem to be fairly positive, so who knows.

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lorcan_nagle

[Martin Smith]

Dave wrote:

You’ll always get fans moaning (often a small group complaining loudly)

• This reply was modified 3 years, 1 month ago by Martin Smith. Reason: replacing hotlink with attached image
• This reply was modified 3 years, 1 month ago by Martin Smith.

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garjones, Dave, lorcan_nagle

I guess it is the joy of fandom though. A certain generation adore the McCoy run despite the fact that 80% of his stories were dogshit partially saved by a few decent episodes when it was cancelled.

I’d trade the last 4 episodes of Doctor Who for the entire run of (Colin) Baker and McCoy.

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lorcan_nagle

A lot of it depends who you grow up with I think. I grew up in the era of McCoy (and Pertwee repeats) and so I still have some nostalgic affection for those eras, much moreso than for Tom Baker, say, even if they weren’t better than him when you look at it more objectively.

And that’s not just signficant for fans but for creators too. Just like we see in long-running comics franchises, I think with Doctor Who you get generations of creators who grew up on a certain era of the character and then look to recreate elements of that era when they take the reins.

Who knows, maybe in 30 years we’ll have a showrunner who harks back to Chibnall’s run as a golden era for the show, and remembers the Doctor turning into a weeping angel in the same way that I remember that Dalek floating up the stairs to attack McCoy.

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garjones, lorcan_nagle

I’m finishing off season 23 this evening. For all that the Valeyard ends up a confused mess of a character (as the last two episodes of Trial are entirely) Michael Jayston is excellent as him. A good whack of that is down to his maniacal laugh and tremendous voice generally.

Some fun features on the set. Toby Hadoke visits people who contributed to the 1986 Doctor Who cookbook and gets them to cook their recipes. Another excellent Matthew Sweet interview, this time with Bonnie Langford (who is someone has avoided a lot of Who special features previously, so it’s interesting to hear from her). A discussion with the writers that were going to contribute to the “lost” season of 1985. Oh and that Open Air segment, which I don’t think I could bear the cringe of watching.

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lorcan_nagle

Dave wrote:

A lot of it depends who you grow up with I think. I grew up in the era of McCoy (and Pertwee repeats) and so I still have some nostalgic affection for those eras, much moreso than for Tom Baker, say, even if they weren’t better than him when you look at it more objectively.

And that’s not just signficant for fans but for creators too. Just like we see in long-running comics franchises, I think with Doctor Who you get generations of creators who grew up on a certain era of the character and then look to recreate elements of that era when they take the reins.

Who knows, maybe in 30 years we’ll have a showrunner who harks back to Chibnall’s run as a golden era for the show, and remembers the Doctor turning into a weeping angel in the same way that I remember that Dalek floating up the stairs to attack McCoy.

The first episodes of DW I ever saw were from the Baker era, so I have a special place in my heart for that version. I never watched it regularly, instead an episode here and there.

As I have said before, “my” Doctor is Paul McGann’s Eighth. It came at the right time for me. Had it become a series, I definitely would have watched it.